How Bettye LaVette Finally Learned to Let The Songs Sound Like Her (Part 1 of 2)

When Bettye LaVette covered “Your Time to Cry” nearly fifty years ago, she wrung every ounce of hurt and drama from the lyrics, but especially on the chorus. She stretches out the word “time” until it breaks into two syllables, implying a similar emotional break that doesn’t undercut the song’s determination, but shows what cost she has paid for it. It’s a riveting performance, a raw, southern soul slow burner that should have established her as one of the finest R&B voices of the 1970s.

During those same sessions, she also covered Neil Young’s “Heart of Gold” and John Prine’s “Souvenirs,” among other tunes, yet for reasons that were never made clear, Atlantic Records shelved the project, declining to promote “Your Time to Cry” as a single or to release her debut album. That has been a defining moment in LaVette’s long career — and one she subtly and slyly addresses on her new album, Blackbirds. She is the woman wronged, the embodiment of the music industry’s disregard for talent, especially that of Black women. For three decades LaVette continued to work, developing and strengthening her voice and expanding her repertoire. She explains, “When people say I had a resurgence, I want to say, ‘No, I never stopped. You just didn’t come to where I was!’”

Now, nearly fifty years after recording “Your Time to Cry” in Muscle Shoals, Alabama, she has become one of the finest and most accomplished singers in R&B or any other genre for that matter, with a string of albums that showcase her stylistic range as well as her deep understanding of pop history. After releasing a comeback record on the tiny Blues Express label in 2003, she caught the ear of Andy Kaulkin at Anti- Records, who signed her as a new artist at the height of the soul revival of the 2000s.

Since then, she’s covered The Who for the Kennedy Centers Honors ceremony (famously bringing Pete Townshend to tears), recorded with Drive-By Truckers (back in the Shoals, for an album appropriately titled The Scene of the Crime), and reimagined Dylan tunes so thoroughly even his own bandleader didn’t recognize them. And those original Shoals sessions did finally get an official release, first in 2000 on a small Dutch label and again in 2018 from vinyl specialists Run Out Groove.

Blackbirds is among her most powerful albums: a collection of songs by female artists active from the late 1940s through the early 1960s, including Nancy Wilson, Dinah Washington, and Nina Simone, whom LaVette refers to collectively as “the bridge I came across on.” It’s an album that celebrates these artists, but also emphasizes their shared experiences as Black women in the music industry. “Every broken promise broke my heart,” she sings on “Book of Lies,” a song made famous by Ruth Brown. Her voice is lower than it was in 1972, but no less expressive, and she makes that sentiment more than just romantic; it’s also a professional lament, addressed to the industry that derailed her career so long ago.

We spoke with LaVette about Blackbirds in our second half of the interview; here, she tells BGS about her early hopes and disappointments.

BGS: What was your impression when you were down in Muscle Shoals? Had you been there before you recorded?

LaVette: No! What would I be doing there?! What would you go there for, if you weren’t going to record? They had to win me over. I’d wanted to record in New York and Chicago. I always wanted to be very bougie. But after I had accepted how different my voice was — how un-girly-like it was — I identified more with Solomon Burke and Wilson Pickett and Otis Redding. After I was down there for a day, I was absolutely as happy as I could be. They were absolutely wonderful — and wonderful to me. When I got back to Detroit, I could not stop talking about them, especially with the way they wrote and read music.

Were you ever told why your ‘72 sessions were never released?

That has been one of the big mysteries in my career. I can think of that album and my dog Mickey, that I had when I was 11, and just burst into tears at any time. I had Brad Shapiro, who was Wilson Pickett’s producer. I had the Swampers, who I had wanted. I was at the label that I had loved. But when they told me they weren’t going to release the album, I got up under the dining room table and stayed three or four days. My friends brought me food and wine and joints. I’m telling you, I’m about to cry now. It was to be my first album, after having already had a string of singles. For years, all I had was “Your Turn to Cry.” Whenever people would come in with their latest whatever-it-is at my house or at a party, I always kept that song handy, maybe on a cassette. I’d say, “I made a record that was really, really good one time. Y’all wanna hear it?”

I just found out — when I say “just found out,” I meant in the last twenty years, maybe — that it was a split between Ahmet Ertegun and Jerry Wexler. Jerry Wexler was on my side and Ahmet was on Aretha’s side. For the longest time I never knew what happened. I had no idea, and it sounded so stupid, for thirty years, to tell people, “I have no idea.” Many people had heard “Your Time to Cry,” and they said, “If that stuff is anything like this, I can’t understand.” When Atlantic put “Your Time to Cry” out, it was just out. They didn’t mention it to anyone. They just put it out. What you wanted at a label was to have one of everything, and maybe a junior one of everything, too. So they could see where that wouldn’t work with me and Aretha. I think Diana [Ross] is probably the reason I was never at Motown. Those personalities wouldn’t have worked.

Judging by reissues from those sessions, you had already worked up a pretty diverse repertoire.

My manager, Jim Lewis, who was the assistant to the president of the musicians’ union in Detroit and a trombone player with the Jimmie Lunceford Orchestra, was a hard, hard taskmaster. When we started to work this management thing out, he said, “You’re cute. You’ve got a cute little waistline and a cute little butt, but you’re going to have to learn some songs, because there’s a possibility you may not be a big star.” That’s not a given, but you can be a singer for the rest of your life, if you will learn a lot of songs. He said, “You’re a different kind of singer, and you should learn that.”

How so?

I’ve accepted that I sound more like James Brown than Doris Day. But I used to think I had to sound the way Nancy Wilson sounds, which discouraged me from even wanting to learn how to sing. The thought that I could sing it and it didn’t have to sound beautiful didn’t even occur to me, until Jim came along. He told me, “Just let ‘em come out of your mouth. They’re gonna sound like you.” So I had to satisfy myself with the songs. I had to choose songs that I really like, and I would tell people, “Do you like the song or do you like the record? Because those are two different things.”

Jim made me learn a lot of songs. He insisted I learn “Lush Life,” which permitted me to be comfortable at the Carlyle Hotel for ten years. He insisted I learn “Sweet Georgia Brown” and “God Bless the Child,” which put me in the lead role in Bubbling Brown Sugar. He made me learn country and western. Otherwise, I would have been fighting with the local songwriters over them giving songs to Aretha and not giving them to me, you know? I was able to say, “Hey, I can go on and just be real good.” So I approach what I’m doing a little differently. I thought Jim was telling me to sing these songs like these people, but he just wanted me to sing them how they came out of my mouth. However they come out, sing them like that. Now that I’ve accepted that, I’m not so concerned about how it sounds, but how I feel about the song. That helps me present it. I’m very grateful to him.

That comes through on these sessions from 1972, where you’re covering Neil Young and John Prine and doing a song that Bowie was doing at the same time. There’s that range.

Well, it was after that that I did “What Condition My Condition Is In” by Kenny Rogers and the First Edition. And that got me another record contract. Kenny Rogers came to Detroit and Jim said, “Why don’t you take it and let him hear it?” I didn’t think he’d like it, but Jim said, “You don’t know how it’ll sound to him.” So I took it to him and Kenny loved it. His brother, Lelan Rogers, was just starting a record label called Silver Fox, and they flew me down to Nashville. I was with them for four or five years, but still no album. All these albums were set to come out and didn’t come out.

After finally breaking out in the 2000s, you established yourself as an interpreter of songs. What do you bring to a song? How do you make something familiar sound like you? Or is that even something you’re thinking about at this point?

That isn’t something that I plan or set out to do. When I hear the song and start to sing it, that’s just the way I sing it. The thing that makes it new is that it’s different. I doubt I could come up with anything new. But it is different, and so I need for people to change their attitude about it. That was one of the things with Interpretations, my British rock album. The thing that helped me the most recording that album was that I didn’t know most of the songs. I had never heard most of them. They didn’t play them a lot on Black radio. So all I did was just lift the lyrics and sing them the want I wanted to.

Michael Stevens was brilliant, and he did the arrangement of “Love, Reign O’er Me” by The Who that I did for the Kennedy Center Honors. When I went to rehearsal, they got ready to go into the tune, and I told him, “I can’t sing it like that.” And he said, “Well, sing it the way you want to sing it.” So I sang the song to him a cappella, and he took a break and after a while came back and redirected everybody. He’d been listening to this song for thirty years — since he was a teenager! — and I’d only been listening to it for three or four days.

Something similar happened on the Bob Dylan album, Things Have Changed. We had Bob Dylan’s guitarist, Larry Campbell, playing on it, and he had a ball. He said, “I’ve wanted to hear these a different way for seventeen years!” Because he knew about the inner workings of each one of the tunes, more than any of us, he started to find clever little things, probably, that he had always wanted to play, and he played them for me.

How was working with these songs on Blackbirds different?

Working on this album was intimidating, in that I didn’t want to bastardize any of the songs or cast them off. I didn’t want to do anything to them just for the sake of doing something, you know? That was kind of daunting. But that’s the thing that makes Steve [Jordan, producer] so important to me. When we develop an arrangement, what I usually do is I’ll get my keyboard player to go in the direction that I want to take the song.

When Steve hears me with the piano, singing it the way I want to sing it, that speaks to him to put something else in there. He no longer hears Billie Holiday’s interpretation of “Strange Fruit,” and he arranges what he hears in his head, not what the other record was. I’m not going to change any of the notes — I’m just going to put them in different places and say them differently, so you can’t follow that trajectory that you know from the record. It has to be different.

(Editor’s Note: Read part two of our interview with Bettye LaVette.)


Photo credit: Joseph A. Rosen

On These 10 Recordings, Willie Nelson and Black Musicians Share a Creative Vision

Willie Nelson has long been not just an American musical treasure, but an iconic figure with far more appeal across racial and generational lines than often recognized. At 87, he’s achieved a perfect marriage of artistry and commercial success few have in any idiom. While certainly a country legend, and the only person in the genre to ever achieve a Top 10 hit in seven different decades, he’s also collaborated with an astonishing number of artists across a wide swath of musical styles and approaches. He’s penned numerous anthems that have been covered by jazz, blues, R&B, soul, rock and pop vocalists, and this month he released his 70th studio album, First Rose of Spring.

Nelson’s never been afraid to stand up for social justice, even when those words weren’t part of the popular vernacular. Early in Charley Pride’s career, Nelson actually gave him a kiss on stage in Louisiana, quieting an audience that was allowing some of its more verbally racist louts to heckle Pride on stage. He’s always included Black musicians in Farm Aid concerts, had one of his biggest albums ever (Stardust) produced by a Black man (Booker T. Jones, who raved about Nelson in his autobiography) and has maintained a friendship with Snoop Dogg since long before Lil Nas X appeared on the scene. He also enjoyed a very close relationship with Ray Charles, who Nelson lamented he could never beat at chess.

He’s in the same company with people like Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, and Bill Monroe, whose output, personality and consistent brilliance has endured despite changes in production, audience preferences, and many other variables that can negatively affect the careers of popular musicians. Part of the reason for that longevity is Nelson’s undeniable skill in multiple areas. He’s penned a host of songs that are every bit as epic as those from the pre-rock canon he often samples. Had he only written “Crazy,” “Funny How Time Slips Away,” or “On the Road Again,” that would have been enough for one lifetime. He’s also a very credible singer, highly effective in pacing and telling a story.

Nelson has consistently embraced and operated in other genres by neither sacrificing his musical individuality and integrity, nor seeming to pander or simply attempting to seem hip. Actually, he’s the epitome of that term, though in a vastly different way from someone like Miles Davis, who was known as much for fashion and fine cars as musical innovation. The fact that Nelson has appeared in more than 30 films just adds weight to his universal appeal.

Trying to pick the best of Nelson’s numerous collaborations with great Black singers and musicians is a tricky thing. One could easily select 10 one day, then come back and tab a different 10 another time. But these are some (far from all) personal favorites. They are ranked in order only by year, nothing more. We picked a mix of singles and LPs, but it’s just a small sample of the many wonderful things he’s done. By no means would we claim this is the definitive list for Willie Nelson’s collaborations with African American artists, but it’s a good sampler and an indicator of how widespread his impact and willingness to work with various musicians actually extends.

SINGLES AND ALBUM CUTS

“Man With The Blues” with Buckwheat Zydeco
From Five Card Stud (1994)

The greatest zydeco master since Clifton Chenier teams with Nelson for a smoky, delightful romp that sees Buckwheat Zydeco also find a comfort zone vocally and instrumentally. As is always the case, Nelson easily works himself into the arrangement, and the two sound right at home in this setting.


“Night Life” with B.B. King
From Deuces Wild (1997)

The King of the Blues sounds happy and engaged on one of Nelson’s earliest compositions, providing some taut guitar licks and outstanding lead and harmony vocals while Nelson doesn’t try to match the improvisational edge, instead easing into a nice zone that’s part complimentary, part quite different in style and sound, but ideal for the situation.


“Still Is Still Moving to Me” with Toots & the Maytals
From True Love (2004)

Toots brings some Jamaican soul and lots of energy to this collaboration, while Willie seems a bit more energetic as the song works its way through. This is one of many performances that earned this LP the Reggae Grammy, and Nelson had such a great time he made a follow-up of his own and paid Toots and company back by having them guest on it.


“Busted” with Ray Charles
From Genius & Friends (2004)

I know “Seven Spanish Angels” was a number 1 hit and more people remember it fondly, but this late redo of an early Charles hit has equal doses of warmth, reflection and edge in both voices. Charles was certainly not at his vocal peak, but he found a way to make his treatment effective, while Willie as always proves the ideal partner in multiple ways.


“Family Bible” with The Blind Boys of Alabama
From Take the High Road (2011)

The album title indicates precisely what Nelson does here, singing with verve and fire while the Blind Boys bring some of their characteristic Golden Age gospel energy and intensity to this rendition that’s alternately wistful, memorable and poignant. This composition dates back to Nelson’s late ’50s catalog, while he was trying to get heard as a songwriter.


“Grandma’s Hands” with Mavis Staples
From To All the Girls (2013)

Mavis Staples has one foot in the church and the other in the street with her customarily powerhouse voice setting the tone. Nelson manages not to get overridden or canceled out in the process as they do their own special version of the Bill Withers hit, which the Staples Singers cut for their 1973 Stax LP, Be What You Are.


“Last Night I Had the Strangest Dream” with Charles Lloyd and the Marvels
From I Long to See You (2015)

The great Memphis jazz man Charles Lloyd and his newest group provide the backing for what comes off as a cross between a nightmarish vision and a marvelous revelation, sung in emphatic fashion by Nelson and punctuated by Lloyd adding some nifty licks underneath and the Marvels adding some musical punch.


ALBUMS

Country Man (2005)

A follow-up to his appearance on Toots’ LP the year before, Nelson goes full bore into reggae territory. Some of it works, some of it doesn’t, but all of it is performed with enthusiasm and joy. Nelson vocally handles the skittering reggae rhythms well, and on the disc’s best songs surpasses what he did on True Love.


Two Men and the Blues (2008)

Wynton Marsalis as a youthful prodigy had a lot of negative things to say about a lot of things back in the ’70s and early ’80s, and country music wasn’t spared in his broadsides. But fast forward all these years later and his gorgeous trumpet solos (both full and muted) made a great musical partner and support system for Nelson, who by now was so familiar with pre-rock, blues, and even traditional jazz tunes and rhythms that it was super smooth sailing from first note to the end. Also recommended: the DVDs Live From Jazz at Lincoln Center with Wynton Marsalis (2008) and Willie Nelson & Wynton Marsalis Play the Music of Ray Charles (2009).


Here We Go Again: Celebrating the Genius of Ray Charles (2011)

Marsalis and Norah Jones joined Nelson to pay homage to his friend Ray Charles, doing wonderful renditions of both hits and more obscure Charles tunes before a rousing audience. Nelson sounded especially energetic throughout, while Marsalis, who’s often been accused of being more technically expert than emotionally powerful, delivered crushing solos and accompaniment, and Jones was equal parts alluring and engaging. As always, Nelson comes across as sincere and genuine, a marvelous mix of down-home sensibility and attitude.


Photos: Pamela Springsteen

LISTEN: The Sons of the Soul Revivers, “It Isn’t Safe”

Artist: The Sons of the Soul Revivers
Hometown: Vallejo, California
Song: “It Isn’t Safe”
Album: Songs We’ll Always Sing: A Tribute to the Pilgrim Jubilees
Release Date: July 12, 2020
Label: Little Village Foundation

In Their Words: “Ever since I heard the album the Pilgrim Jubilees put out in 1973, the title is Don’t Let Him Down, I think I’ve gravitated especially to this song, ‘It Isn’t Safe.’ It was the last song on the ‘B’ side. And Cleve Graham, the leader of the Jubilees, shared with us the premise of that song. They were in Chicago, and Cleve said his brother Clay, who’s no longer with us, may he rest in peace, walked in and had a disgusted look on his face. Walking back from church, he’d seen two men attacking a lady. And Clay said, ‘You know what? It isn’t safe anywhere anymore.’ And he wrote the song.

“The message in it, from 1973 and here we are in 2020, and the message is still on point. The distrust of law enforcement, and law enforcement distrusts the public… we have yet to come to a common ground on how we can get along. I’m hoping and praying that this song will resonate with people in general. The lyric goes, ‘We should treat sin just like dirt, and with the broom of faith we should sweep it aside.’ I love that. It’s the only way we’re going to survive. ‘Do unto others as you would have them do to you, I declare that this is all you have to do. It isn’t safe….'” — James Morgan, The Sons of the Soul Revivers


Photo courtesy of the Sons of the Soul Revivers

MIXTAPE: Caleb Caudle’s Country Funk Favorites

There’s a special thing that happens when the groove of soul music meets the sharp pen of country music. I’ve heard folks call it Country Soul, Country Funk, Cosmic American Music or simply “The Rub.” I refer to it as Down Home Funk. It keeps the toes tapping and the mind thinking. The special blend is a sound I gravitated towards a few years ago and it really made its way into my new record, Better Hurry Up. — Caleb Caudle

Guy Clark – “Texas Cookin’”

Guy comes out swingin’ on his sophomore record with the funkiest rhythm to any of his tunes up to that point. It’s so greasy and I’m hungry just listening to it right now. Long live food in songs!

Bill Withers – “Grandma’s Hands”

Drenched with nostalgia, this is one of my favorite tunes from Mr. Withers. He puts his personal experiences in a songs and something personal becomes so relatable. It gets me thinking about my own grandma. I’m a sucker for that Wurlitzer.

Bobbie Gentry – “Louisiana Man”

The first time I heard this tune was on a Doug Kershaw record. I love how she makes it her own. She has one of my very favorite voices. Even got a little bitty muskrat cousin! Bless it.

The Band – “Up on Cripple Creek”

I mean who am I kidding? This whole playlist could be The Band. They changed the way I heard music. They take every brand of roots music and blend it up effortlessly and effectively. God bless Levon Helm and all of his magic. I’ve touched the horseshoe at Big Pink on three separate occasions. It’s a healthy obsession.

Jeannie C. Riley – “Back Side of Dallas”

I got turned on to this tune from the Cocaine & Rhinestones three-parter on “Harper Valley PTA.” I love the vocal delivery here. Total swagger. The band is bold and the lyrics are gritty. Just feels real man, I dig it.

JJ Cale – “Lies”

His groove is so perfect, I feel like he drops the listener right into it. His guitar tone is always so on point. I’ve spent way too much time watching YouTube videos and trying to figure out what all is going on. Lies, Lies, Lies!

Townes Van Zandt – “Where I Lead Me”

I like sad TVZ a lot but I love TVZ when he has a chip on his shoulder and a blues band behind him. Everything feels nice and loose. I’ve always loved the line “In the meantime, make a little money and buy a little mercy”

Aretha Franklin – “The Weight”

As much as I love the original from The Band, I consider this the definitive version. The band is great, especially that slide work from Brother Duane. She is peaking the mic all over this one and it’s just so perfect.

Bobby Charles – “Small Town Talk”

Being from a small town, this one hits home. I love this Bobby Charles self-titled record. I hope more folks get turned on to it. The whole record sounds like a ferry ride down the Mississippi River. Who are we to judge one another? That could cause a lot of hurt.

Dolly Parton – “Jolene”

What hasn’t been said about this tune? I think the greatness comes from it still sounding fresh to this day. The riff, the vocal, the lyrics… this is a perfect song. I’m sure it really stood out on country radio at the time. It’s haunting. I can’t remember a time when I didn’t know this song.

Leon Russell – “Tight Rope”

Like The Band, I’m sure I could have made this whole playlist the master of space and time. He’s peculiar and familiar at the same time. I like the way this one bounces. A great opening track for my favorite record of his, Carney.

Linda Ronstadt – “Willin’”

I was familiar with the Little Feat version because it was all over classic rock radio when I was growing up. I recently got turned on to this take, I really love how patient it is. Great vocal take from Linda.


Photo credit: Laura E. Partain

LISTEN: Darrell Scott, “Fool About You”

Artist: Darrell Scott
Hometown: Nashville, Tennessee
Song: “Fool About You”
Album: Darrell Scott Sings the Blues of Hank Williams
Release Dates: March 13, 2020 (single); April 24, 2020 (album)
Label: Full Light Records / Soundly Music

In Their Words: “I remember this song from early childhood — it was one my dad sang at home. Hank did not write it, but it was fun, it grooves, and it talks about flop-eared mules and hogs rooting under a fence… what more do you want out of a song?” — Darrell Scott


Photo credit: Gabriel Scott

WATCH: Yola, “Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”

Artist: Yola
Hometown: Bristol, England
Song: “Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”
Album: Walk Through Fire: Deluxe Edition
(Featuring “I Don’t Wanna Lie” and “Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”)

In Their Words: “Can’t believe it has only been a year since we announced Walk Through Fire, working with Dan Auerbach and the team has been an absolute dream and [I am] so proud of everything we have achieved. So many great songs from that session didn’t make the final cut, including ‘I Don’t Wanna Lie.’ I’m a HUGE Elton fan and we’ve been playing ‘Goodbye Yellow Brick Road’ on the tour and wanted to cut a version for this release, which Dan also produced! And then for Elton to personally premiere it, well that is the icing on the cake!” — Yola


Photo credit: Daniel Jackson

WATCH: Yola Makes Her Grand Ole Opry Debut

Bold, brilliant, beautiful, and British — these are just a few words that describe the music of singer/songwriter Yola. 2019 has been monumental for the new queen of country soul from across the sea as she collaborated with Black Keys’ founder and Nashville hotshot producer Dan Auerbach to produce her solo debut, Walk Through Fire.

Her powerful voice and old school styling reinvigorate the tradition of combining country and soul music, a classic bridging of two seemingly unrelated musical traditions; and an accomplishment Yola’s musical heroes Charley Pride and Dolly Parton would admire. Among her more recent success, Yola was featured in a song from The Highwomen’s first album and in September, she made her debut on country music’s most famous stage.

Watch as Yola shows us around Nashville and takes us behind the scenes of her Grand Ole Opry debut.


Photo Credit: Alysse Gafkjen

Britain’s Yola Blends Soul, Country, and ’60s Pop on Astonishing Debut

If you’ve ever had the good fortune of being in the audience for one of Yola’s live shows, you will have been utterly blown away not only by the power of the British singer/songwriter’s voice and the intensity of her songs’ arrangements, but also by the bedlam her audiences devolve into in the presence of such a commanding, charming, visibly strong black woman. Yola owns each of these unabashed facets of her identity with bright-eyed self-awareness and unbridled joy, all of which pour forth from her astonishing debut album, Walk Through Fire.

This grandiose power that Yola possesses is deliberately not the focal point of the album, though. She and her collaborator/producer Dan Auerbach have artfully balanced the wildness of Yola’s experiences in myriad genres (pop, electronic, and rock among them) with the subtlety and nuance that her deft songwriting demands. It’s not just an album sung by a “strong black woman,” it’s not just country-soul, it’s not just a late ’60s/early ’70s pop throwback, it’s not just a collection of heart-wrenching, impossibly visceral love songs — it’s effortlessly and masterfully all of the above.

We sat down with Yola during her release week press gambit in Nashville and began our conversation recapping this year’s Grammy Awards.

BGS: In one of her Grammy acceptance speeches this year Brandi Carlile called Americana  “An island of misfits.” I wonder if you agree — and what do you feel like you bring to this island of misfits?

Yola: I do agree. I think Brandi Carlile is on point by saying that. It feels as though people have congregated in Americana, maybe even running from other genres. It’s a place where we are celebrating eclecticism and being open and we’re at least seeking to be diverse — and trying to understand that diversity, instead of having fingers in the ears. There’s a little bit more to the scene. It allows people like Brandi Carlile to rise to the top, and rightfully so, because of their talent!

I have found, for me, that after being associated with a lot of different genres over the years, I’ve had to fight to just be me. I’ve had to do as much fighting in this particular scene, because everyone’s crossing something with something or being more unexpected than other genres. Doing shows at AmericanaFest and in this particular scene has given me a chance to develop. Full stop. And to get started.

When I first started I was pretty terrified to do what I was doing. Americana allows me to be like, “Hi, okay, I’m the black British woman with the afro — no, not the other one, the one called Yola.” [Laughs] And I can go, “Okay, I’m going to mix some soul with some country, but not in the way you think I’m going to do that.” Yes there’s going to be a ’60s pop sound in there, but again, probably not in the way you think I’m going to do that, either. Maybe it is my Britishness that is giving me the angle from which I approach each thing.

I feel like the album is decidedly country-soul, and it’s interesting to me because we’re in this community — Americana with a capital A — that is majority-white.

Mhmm. Heck yeah!

We’re working on diversity, like you said, but we’re a work in progress. So I wonder how you feel your blackness is part of that country-soul designation and how much of that is not connected to your blackness, as well. I feel like so many people, especially in the audience for your shows, see you step up on stage and they’re ready to scream and holler because there’s a “strong black woman” presence on stage–

Yes.

So I wonder do you feel a differentiation between what you’re establishing as country-soul for country-soul’s sake, and how much comes from your identity as a black woman?

Well, I think it starts with identity, because everything starts from within and from where you think you fit. Where do I fit? I think my entire musical journey has been based on where the frick I fit.

An island of misfits.

Yes, exactly. I found a bunch of weirdos that were as weird as I was and was like, “This is great!” [Laughs] That’s what has led me where I want to go, musically. It’s about finding what my voice wants to do. It’s all about the physicality of my voice, it’s got a soft side, almost choral, that then flips to this big, yelly, slightly more Tina [Turner] side. I can move very smoothly from one to the other. My voice is a seesaw in that situation. I need to be able to be the fullness of myself, so that’s kind of where the country-soul comes from — from within.

That’s at least physically what it is, as well as growing up listening to that music, listening to people who were already doing what I’m doing. I’m by no means inventing the wheel or even reinventing it, for that matter. It’s something that’s just been done. Ray Charles has done it. Mavis is doing it. Maybe the way I’m doing it, with this retro pop kind of angle, is something that others haven’t done, necessarily. But that is narrow in comparison to the vast eclecticism of my musical taste. It’s out of control how broad a day’s playlist can sound.

We’ve talked about this, because I want you to make a bluegrass record!

[Laughs] You’re like, “Are you ready to do that?” And I’m like, “Hey, I’ve got so many genres to get through right now!”

Add it to the list.

Just tack it on, you know? I don’t know if I’m going to go all the way like, Beck levels of breadth. He’s covered some ground, it’s impressive. But I’m enjoying this kind of freedom right now. As fun as it is knowing that country and soul are always going to come out, it’s nice to be able to be free enough to explore gospel and blues and rock and roll and pop. You can hear from the record there are probably four comfortable genres within it and they all move completely seamlessly from one to the next. That’s what I love about music. I love how close it all is.

Going back to the physicality of your voice for a moment, one of the things that struck me about the album is that it feels like you’re laying back–

Mmmm. You know me!

It feels like you’re being reserved, your signature Yola-dialed-up-to-eleven isn’t there all of the time. Talk me through that less-is-more decision making process.

Certainly, the songs kind of spoke for themselves. When you finish writing a song you can decide whether you’re going to tack a big ol’ outro on the end of it and then whether you’re going to freaking scream to the heights of the ceiling on that outro. But I thought, I don’t know whether I listen to albums where the singer is going hell-for-leather, top to bottom, all the way through. I like to listen to albums top to bottom and I like a bit of a gradient. So as the songs come, one by one, I kind of have a look and think, “Okay, I don’t think the song needs this.” It’s about trying to respect the song and the will of the song. Sometimes the song really needs it, like “It Ain’t Easier.” I’m going to go there! [Laughs] I was purposefully selective and I think it was each song that led me.

The songs do feel like they’re all related, but they’re all distinct. For instance, “Still Gone” and “Keep Me Here” back to back feel like the same story told from slightly different perspectives.

They are! “Still Gone,” in my mind is about being in a relationship. You met someone, they were amazing, then whoever the heck that person was, they fucked off and the person you end up with is your consolation prize. You’re looking over your shoulder thinking, “Oh, still gone!” It’s like chasing the dragon, but it’s the person you were dating. That first hit, that’s the one. Everything else after just pales in comparison. It’s very much that moment of realization, that moment before you start checking out of the new relationship, when you start staring off into the distance.

That faraway look in your eye!

That faraway look in your eye! It’s all tied together. That’s the precursor feeling. It’s the “You’re literally everywhere, but you’re not here” situation.

So “Keep Me Here” turns that same idea on its ear.

It does! Because you haven’t got the guts to be alone. You’re being a chicken. You’re being fed, again, chasing the dragon. Like, “That first hit was good, can’t we just have that bit?” No, you can’t. You have to have the full wonderful person — especially when they’re not wonderful, that’s challenging. You’re just hoping for those little moments, those little glimpses that keep you hooked in. In my situation, I was working with my ex, my partner at the time, and so it was very much like being totally hooked, and musically hooked, and socially hooked, and all of these hooks become something that keep you holding on in light of glaringly horrible interactions in every part of your life. I think it takes a lot of self esteem to grow up enough to realize you need to move on. The twenties are not really the time when self esteem is at its full!

It’s funny that we begin that “chasing the dragon” when we’re in our twenties when we have no idea what that thing actually is.

[Laughs] Exactly! We have no idea! But we’re just desperately going for the thing. It felt good that one time, maybe it will happen again. It’s about as well-advised as taking smack, you know? It shouldn’t be like a hit, though. It should be consistent. But you don’t learn about the healthy ways of doing life until you have the experience.


Photo credit: Alysse Gafkjen

Crys Matthews: Driving Out Hate with Love

After she describes her multi-faceted identity, Americana and country soul singer/songwriter Crys Matthews laughs with a slight trace of self-deprecation, “I’m the poster child for intersectionality, right?!” She is.

While each and every day, on each and every media platform, we’re reminded of the division, alienation, marginalization, and divisiveness rampant in our country (and our world), we’re not often enough met with people like Matthews who exist as reminders of what beauty can occur when we bridge those divides.

A native of the South and the daughter of a preacher, this Americana-creating, Black lesbian — who is in an interracial marriage — understands and appreciates the myriad ways her background informs her ability to help others empathize with those with whom they might assume they have nothing in common. With her recent full-length album, The Imagineers, and her compassionate, politically charged EP, she is recruiting an “Army of Lovers,” despite all of the divides — real or perceived — that come between us, driving out hate not with hate, but with love.

Country or Americana or roots music fans might not expect someone described like you to fit into this music. How did you come into roots music? What’s your background in it?

I was born and raised in North Carolina — I live in Virginia now — and I went to college at Appalachian State University in Boone, North Carolina, which is a bluegrass Mecca. I never set out to really create [within] any specific genre of music or anything like that. My songwriting process, it’s very organic. The songs just come out how they come out. Living in Boone all that time, I just fell in love with the Blue Ridge and with all of that. I guess osmosis is what you would say — it just fused its way into my music and into my songwriting style. It seems like every year it just gets country-er and country-er, which is hilarious to me. [Laughs] Listening back through the newest album I was like, “Oh, my God, my grandpa would be so proud!”

Did your grandpa get you into country music?

Oh yeah, we’re so Southern. Like I said, born and raised in North Carolina, but in the southeastern part of North Carolina. It is so country over there. [Laughs] I grew up watching The Dukes of Hazzard and other stuff that you wouldn’t necessarily expect. I guess it feels foreign to people when they think about, okay, “A Black lesbian isn’t going to be watching Dukes of Hazzard with her grandpa.” But, if you grew up in southeastern North Carolina, I’m pretty sure almost everyone watched The Dukes of Hazzard no matter what, no matter who you were. I’ve never lived my life trying to fit into any specific thing. I just am who I am, and the things that I’m into are just the things I’m into. The things I think about, think are beautiful, and love in the world center so heavily around my home state.

The title track of your EP, Battle Hymn for an Army of Lovers, is an upbeat, hopeful number. It’s looking to the future and outward-facing, but it’s also very realistic and grounded. It’s not denying the realities of this moment in time. Why did you strike that balance?

I always try to be like that in life. I feel like every big moment that has ever happened in this country has happened, at the root of it, because of love. And because of somebody loving somebody else and/or not being okay with the person that they love not having fair treatment, in some regard.

My worldview is that love is always the thing that moves us forward. It always is and it probably always will be. It’s super important to me. As frustrating and hard as this moment is for me, obviously, as a triple-minority, it is terrifying for me living in this time, I trust and believe so deeply that love will move us forward. It was very important for me to use that song and use that message for rallying the army of lovers, mobilizing the army of lovers, and believing wholeheartedly in trying to live that notion of Dr. King’s, that hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that.

I appreciate in your music that you’re including specific calls to action. In your song “Paris Is Burning,” you sing, “Dark days call for more than profile picture overlays,” and that line resonates so much with me because we’re in a time when just showing up doesn’t really count for much anymore. You aren’t letting listeners and fans feel like just putting on your EP is taking action.

Again, growing up in the South, the history of activism, what it means, and how important it is is not lost on me. Being a singer/songwriter, having a platform, and with people actually listening to what I have to say, it would be so hypocritical to not use that platform, in some regard, to actually have a call to action, to let people know what’s happening in the world beyond their possibly limited view, let them know things that they can do to help. And people who aren’t them, who may not have whatever privilege they may have, need them to help. It was super important to have the mindset of the soundtrack of the resistance.

I went into it hoping that it would come out in a way that would motivate people, and inspire people, and make them do something. It’s so hard feeling so powerless, and I think so many of us are so frustrated right now, because we feel powerless, but we’re not. It’s important to remember that. I hope that these songs remind people that there are things that we can do. We cannot be complacent. We have to act.

As a triple-minority, like you said before, you don’t exactly have the luxury or privilege of choosing how much or how little of your identity is visible through your art, but I wonder if you think about how much you present in your songs, or if you just let that happen organically, as well?

It depends on certain songs. I have this song from my album, Come What May, called “You Remind Me,” that [was inspired by] the Lovings of Virginia [of the U.S. Supreme Court case on interracial marriage, Loving v. Virginia] and Edith Windsor and Thea Spyer [of the case United States v. Windsor on same-sex marriage]. It’s about how we keep having to learn the same lesson in this country about love, and how we can’t seem to let people love who they want to love. It’s a parallel of those two things and, of course, my wife and I decided we wanted to piss everybody off and be an interracial, lesbian couple. [Laughs]

The love songs, for me, I feel like those things are just so universal. Only people who don’t realize how universal they are think that they’re different and weird. People are like, “Oh my God! Gay marriage!” And I think, “If you could just see us sitting on the couch with our cats and dogs and bunny, being like, ‘Are we going to watch TV? What are we doing?’” It’s so boring! [Laughs] It’s just what everyone else is doing on their couch at the end of a work day. It’s crazy that we even have any kind of distinction between the two, because it is literally so boring.

Me, personally, I’ve been married for four years. In general, we’re just as mundane as every other person who’s been married for four years. In the love songs, I don’t try to make an effort to make them any more “normal” or any more heteronormative. That’s just the reality of it. I think that people would be better served to actually realize and know that. It’s always fun for me, when I write a song that’s about my life, and somebody’s like, “I feel the exact same way about my husband!” or “I feel the exact same way about my wife!” Because inside I’m like, “Yes. That’s the point.”

That’s what it means to be human.

Exactly. The best line I think Jason Mraz ever wrote was in regard to humanity. He says, “Our name is our virtue.” That’s so much it. If we could just be more human, that’s all we ever need to do.

How do you think we can bridge the gap that divides all of us right now? Do you think it’s just playing these songs and letting it filter in for people?

I do. I really do. The hard thing for us to do is engage one another. It’s a scary thing — rejection is a scary thing, being the butt of somebody’s anger is a very scary thing — but we have to engage each other. I sing the songs that are a little more difficult in places where it’s not necessarily the most advisable thing for me to do. Ultimately, if I don’t make those people think, if I can’t make them feel something or think something, they’re not going to do it on their own, because they’re only going to be hanging out with the same type of people. I feel like we have a responsibility to put ourselves in those uncomfortable situations for the good of the whole. We have to do it.

It’s very difficult traversing this world with a limited worldview. It’s so easy, for so many of us, to just be comfortable. If you’re a 30-year-old white guy, with all of your 30-year-old white guy friends, it’s not that you’re a bad person; it’s not that you don’t care about anyone else’s issues or their daily life. It’s just not your reality because it’s not something you see every day. Worldviews are so different. Simple things can help people think, but it’s so much easier to be comfortable. Whereas, with me, I don’t really have a choice. I’m always in various multi-cultural situations. If more of us did that, it would just be second nature to realize what somebody else’s walk through life looks like because you aren’t just having to imagine it; you’re literally standing there watching it.


Photo credit: Sarah Stuart