Open Mic: Charlie Peacock Pushes Through Chronic Pain on ‘EVERY KIND OF UH-OH’

With a 40+ year career spanning virtually every aspect of the music business – from performing and songwriting to production, development and even education – Charlie Peacock has battled myriad creative challenges. A standout in the Contemporary Christian format who was also deeply involved in the Americana folk boom of the 2010s (he was even the driving force behind The Civil Wars’ mainstream emergence), no problem seemed too big to handle. But for his new album EVERY KIND OF UH-OH, Peacock had to overcome an obstacle unlike the rest: a rare, debilitating health condition.

Diagnosed with Dysautonomia and Central Sensitization, Peacock has essentially been experiencing a never-ending headache since 2017 – seven grueling years and counting. Needless to say, it has upended the GRAMMY winner’s life, and while some days are better than others, the chronic pain prevented him from music making all together– until a flash of writing in 2023, that is.

Featuring 10 all-new songs penned in a two-week flurry, EVERY KIND OF UH-OH finds Peacock getting back to work, but with fresh appreciation for life’s messy beauty. Co-produced with his son Sam Ashworth, a peaceful mix of dream-folk and gospel match a tender, feathery tenor, as Peacock explores against-the-odds optimism with spirituality, purpose, and humor. In the end, it feels like a veteran songsmith’s statement of revelation; and a set of life lessons delivered with knowledge, not judgement.

Still fighting symptoms on the morning after a party celebrating the album’s arrival, Peacock spoke with BGS about how his life transformed and how it forever changed the way he makes music. Peacock also plans to release his memoir, Roots & Rhythm: A Life in Music in February.

We’re really interested in the way things like creativity and mindfulness and health intersect, so I’m fascinated by your story. Can you just tell me how you’re feeling today – both in a micro sense and in terms of the bigger picture with everything you’ve been through?

Charlie Peacock: Well, just for the background, I have a neurological disorder called Central Sensitization, which is a pain management disorder between the brain and the central nervous system about how pain is managed. So, my brain got tricked into thinking I am in trouble, and it’s sending me pain signals. Basically in the same way that if I scratched my arm on something, that scratch pain is there to tell me, “Hey, there’s something wrong with your arm. You might want to take a look at it.” Well, the brain functions in that way for all our pain management throughout our entire body.

So mine, this disorder that I have is that everyday for almost eight years, I’ve had an intractable headache. I’ve had an eight-year headache basically, and it goes up and down in terms of intensity. Sometimes it’s “You’ve got to go to the hospital” intensity. And most of the time it’s just sort of like a three or a four [on a scale of one to 10]. And I’ve learned to function through various methodologies and mindfulness and various kinds of treatments that I’ve done.

I imagine on top of the physical side of things, it has impacted your creativity. How did this change the way you look at making music?

Well, it got me back in some ways. It got me out of the music business and back into music making.

Really? How so?

At the point when I got sick, I was just turning 60 years old. So I was a 60-year-old man who’d been in the music business for 42 years, who was in writing rooms with 20-somethings. And even though part of my whole thing as a songwriter and a producer is that I’ve stayed relatively current, you’re still a person of your time and your generation. It’s like, could I make a trap song? Absolutely. But will I make one that is convincing to people who listen to trap? Maybe not. …

I was functioning more as the older, experienced sage that comes in and cleans up people’s songs. And so what the illness did was it put me back in that more childlike place of working on my own music and experiencing just the joy of creating, rather than coming in as the expert who’s going to be the song doctor or the producer who’s going to give that artist that extra 23% that makes them commercially viable or something like that. So that has been a real joy. And then of course, as I’ve said many times, it’s like you take care of the music and it takes care of you. That’s been the case just in terms of imagination and creativity during this illness, where it’s been a part of my medicine for sure.

Here we are eight years after the illness started and you’ve got a new record. What changed to bring this music out?

Well, [before] this illness period I had gone to Lipscomb University and created their commercial music program, and then became the head of the School of Music for a year. And it was during that time that I got sick. I was already kind of moving out of the producer-for-hire model and kind of had this education piece that was on my bucket list. So I had gone and done that and then I was just here working, making a lot of music, doing a lot of writing, working on a family, a screenplay for a family story from the 1800s, just doing a bunch of different creative things. …

[After the illness], I just had a willingness to say, “If my music career is over at this point, then I will have been really grateful.” And this memoir is kind the period on the end of the sentence. Then all of a sudden it was like I woke up one morning like “Is that an idea for a song?” It was brewing. So I started working on it and then a few more. And then I asked my son, “Hey, you want to help me finish this song?” I go out to his house and we hang and work on this song. We’re both super excited about it. And then he finally, after hearing more of the music, he was like, “Dad, you got to promise me you’ll take this seriously. Don’t just tell everybody, ‘Hey, I have a new record out on Friday and buy a couple ads on Facebook and call it a day.’ I think you need to actually do an old school release and get a distributor and have them set the record up.”

I said, “I don’t know if I have the energy for that.” But [Sam] said, “Well, I’ll help you.” And so he did help me. Really, the whole family has been a huge help. Sam came alongside me and he co-produced the record and we co-wrote three songs on it. And literally, it’s a 10-song album. Within 14 days. I had all 10 songs written. And it was just one of those times where it was just time to do that. I didn’t know it was, but it was.

Fortunately, I also had some pretty good windows of health that I could [record]. I had some days when I tried to sing where it’s just like, “Man, it’s just not happening.” But I’d wait a few days and get rested up again and go up to the studio and sing, and it would still be there. I was actually surprised myself, some of the range that I was able to sing at still.

Have the songs taken on a new shape for you or a new dimension, topic-wise and thematically?

Well, my great-grandfather was a fiddler in Louisiana and my grandfather from Oklahoma loved to sing all the Okie songs of the era. And I thought, let me just lean into that a little bit. So I would say this record is a little taste of that, especially the instrumentation is pretty much still the same in terms of rootsy guitars and just simple drums and bass and fiddle and pedal steel. And the only difference between this record is I really leaned into the gospel vocal sound. A lot of my friends that have been dominant in Black gospel music. And so that’s a difference. Narrative-wise, I was really trying to do this kind of literary thing that was a mix of plain-speak American roots, with these literary elements, and then also take a spiritual element, but not make it religious, and try to create a narrative that was uniquely American. I think in its influence, it’s almost like reading some of the classic American novelists.

There’s a wonderful mix of storytelling and deeper spirituality, for sure. Thank you, Charlie. I’ll just leave you with the big picture. What do you hope people take away from this record?

I think for me, even listening to the songs and seeing the reaction from folks, what they said afterwards is, “This is a world that I want to enter into. There’s something about what you’re creating on this record, this musical world, and this invitation to come on in that feels really safe and that I will belong here and I’ll be well loved, cared for, not judged – allowed to just be myself.”

And I think that’s what we want. I mean, I think that’s what makes our heart beat, is that we just want to be known totally. We want to be known like the intricacies of our personalities. We don’t want to be known superficially. And I hope there’s something about this music that sends that signal that, yeah, I do too. Come on in and listen and see if you find some of that here.


Photo Credit: Jeremy Cowart

Basic Folk: Bruce Molsky & Darol Anger

The names Bruce Molsky and Darol Anger have come up more often than not when talking to fiddlers on Basic Folk. The pair have single-handedly mentored hundreds of our favorites in fiddle music at Berklee College of Music in Boston, Darol’s online music school, music camps, festivals, and more. The pair joined us on the occasion of their newest folk music collab, their new album Lockdown Breakdown. Folk music has often been associate with nerdiness, so we get right into their nerdy roots with Bruce’s love of fountain pens, his background in mechanical engineering, and all facts about American roots music, bluegrass, and fiddle music you can stand.

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Both talk about their origins: Bruce in the Bronx and Darol in Northern California, which eventually led him to become a co-founding member of the David Grisman Quintet. We discuss the social aspect of the old time and bluegrass world and how that has translated into the way they each approach socializing. Then, we get into the thousands of fiddle lessons they’ve given younger players and why they like to mentor younger generations.

And of course, we chat about the album, which was recorded live in a Nashville studio in just a few days. Darol and Bruce talk about what the energy was like in the room for all their live takes during the session. It was a pleasure to speak with these two very funny, very influential musicians! They are doing incredible and important work.


Photo Credit: Jeppe Blomgren

BGS 5+5: Max McNown

Artist: Max McNown
Hometown: Bend, Oregon
Latest Album: Wandering
Personal Nicknames (or rejected band names): Almost went by Max Winter (Winter is my middle name)!

What rituals do you have, either in the studio or before a show?

My pre-show rituals remain somewhat consistent from show to show. I stay hydrated throughout the day leading up to soundcheck and I typically take it easy on my voice while I rehearse the songs (because I haven’t warmed up at that point). Post-soundcheck, I rest in the green room and use a steam inhaler to clear my sinuses before letting my vocal cords cool down from the heat for at least 30 minutes. After that, I kill time until around 30 minutes before I hit the stage, occupying myself with iPhone games to distract me from the pre-show nerves. At 20 minutes before the show I do a 10 minute vocal routine. At the 10 minute mark I call a circle with my band and say a prayer of thankfulness, asking that whatever happens, we impact the crowd for good. Minutes before stepping on the stage I conduct a box breathing exercise to slow my heart rate, and I’m off to the races!

If you had to write a mission statement for your career, what would it be?

Growing up, I leaned on music to get me through some of my most difficult moments. If I could summarize my “mission” it would be to return that healing… To repay what music has done for me to those who hear my own songs.

How often do you hide behind a character in a song or use “you” when it’s actually “me”?

Considering nearly all my songs are directly influenced by my own life, I hide behind characters often. I purposefully keep it vague when discussing which lines in which songs are fully “true stories.” Some of the most impactful films of my life are “based on a true story” and I take that knowledge into every writing room. Occasionally I take liberties when storytelling, but a lot of my work is pretty accurate to my own life journey.

Does pineapple really belong on pizza?

Considering Hawaiian-style pizza is one of my favorite foods, I strongly believe if you enjoy the taste, you can put whatever you want on pizza!

If you were a color, what shade would you be – and why?

If I were a color I’d have to think I’d be my favorite one, forest green… Simply because of my upbringing in the lush Oregon trees, my green eyes, and my love for nature!


Photo Credit: Benjamin Edwards

Balancing Dreams and Reality: A Folk Debate on Ambition

Welcome to another edition of Folk Debate Club, our occasional debate series! To discuss ambition vs. acceptance, we welcome our panel: music journalist Kim Ruehl, Basic Folk boss Cindy Howes, and yours truly Lizzie No. We would like to extend a very warm welcome to our special guests singer-songwriter Michaela Anne and producer Aaron Shafer-Haiss, also hosts of The Other 22 Hours podcast. In our lively conversation we work through thoughts and feelings about the definition of ambition: a strong desire to do or to achieve something, typically requiring determination and hard work. We take the approach from a music industry, folk music and even dive into the audience perspective of how fans might feel about an artist’s ambition.

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It is no surprise that capitalism gets rung right out as a reason that ambition goes wrong for artists. As Kim says, “​Art ​is ​like ​the ​nervous ​system ​of ​humanity,” and mixing creation with ambition-gone-wrong is a dangerous game that a lot (most?) professional musicians play with at some point in their careers. This episode has everything: navigating our way out of toxic work environments, messy reactions to unpopular yet important political stances and how to not throw away the people who disagree with you. Listen along and enjoy the ride.


Photo Credit: Lizzie No by Cole Neilson; Cindy Howes by Liz Dutton; Michaela Anne and producer Aaron Shafer-Haiss; Kim Ruehl by Rich Amory

BGS 5+5: Lyle de Vitry

Artist: Lyle de Vitry
Hometown: Originally Lancaster, Pennsylvania, but I now live in Asheville, North Carolina.
Latest Album: Door Within A Dream
Personal Nicknames (or rejected band names): I have a lot of nicknames in my family. Pan, Chi, Fluffy Bundun, Lymees, Lyman are a few classics.

Which artist has influenced you the most – and how?

Nick Drake has been a long time favorite and he’s certainly one of my biggest influences. When I was about 14 or 15, I remember diving deep into his records and being so completely blown away by his guitar playing. I had never heard anyone play like that, and it opened up a whole world for me. At that point I wasn’t writing my own music, but I learned some of Nick’s songs and began exploring his tunings, which, to me, were so wonderfully strange and emotionally evocative.

When I started writing my own songs I would often use some of these tunings, as well as some other open tunings I picked up along the way from other artists. Eventually, I began inventing some of my own tunings, which is something I’m not sure I would have been as likely to do had I not delved so deeply into Nick’s work. Playing a guitar in an unfamiliar tuning helps me to get into that childlike, playful state where I’m making discoveries and delighting in them. Like trying ice cream for the first time or leaping into your first icy cold river. In those moments, there is no time or space to feel self-conscious – for your full attention is fixated on this new joyful experience.

I tend to be drawn to artists who sing more softly. In addition to Nick Drake, some of my greatest influences and inspirations include Jose Gonzalez, Sufjan Stevens and, in more recent years, Adrianne Lenker. It’s funny though, I actually have a really big voice when I want to use it – and at one point was considering pursuing a professional career in opera. We’ll see, I might decide to open up my voice a bit more as the years go by and I continue to develop my style. It won’t be opera, but I’m just excited about experimenting with the way I sing, volume level, vibrato, tone, range, etc.

What other art forms – literature, film, dance, painting, etc. – inform your music?

When writing a song, I try my best to write lyrics that could stand alone as a poem. If I’m feeling stuck, I try reading some of my favorite poetry. Mary Oliver, Wendell Berry, and translations of the German poet Rainer Maria Rilke all come to mind.

I’ve always especially loved the work of Mary Oliver. She wrote a lot while walking through the woods and observing the world around her – always practicing looking with as much reverence as she could muster. I try to slow down and notice things like she did. It’s really a practice of awe and amazement – and often with regard to things that appear simple at first glance or that I might take for granted. Or that I just wouldn’t have noticed if I hadn’t waited a little longer and been more patient.

Along with poetry, visual art is another art form that plays a big part in my creative life as a songwriter. Sometimes when I’m experiencing a creative block, I’ll go into a period of just focusing on making really colorful and vibrant abstract visual art. It helps me get out of the self-judgment loop, and I find myself getting back to that kid that’s inside, playing with shapes and color just because it’s fun and not because I hope anyone will think it’s any good. And then I can take that mindset back with me when I return to my songs.

What was the first moment that you knew you wanted to be a musician?

I remember singing my song, “To Be Adored,” for a close friend shortly after I had written it. When I looked up after finishing, he was smiling at me ear to ear and had tears streaming down his face. This same thing happened a few other times with other people – and I began to realize that I could really touch others with my music on a deep emotional level. I’ve always loved music with nostalgic and maybe even sad undertones, and so a lot of the music I make has this kind of feeling. The thing is, “sad” music always made me feel kind of… good? From the beginning, I think I knew I wanted to make sounds that could help people heal in some way, or at least serve as a form of comfort. When I started seeing the impact my music was having on people in real time, I knew I wanted to continue writing and sharing – with the hope that I too could be a healer and could help make the world a little more beautiful.

If you didn’t work in music, what would you do instead?

I would probably be a visual artist/art teacher. Making art has always been one of my favorite things to do – and, as I mentioned, it still sometimes plays a role in my creative practice at times. I’m often thinking about bigger paintings, murals, or other visual projects I want to be making, but usually I’m spending my free time playing music these days. I keep thinking about getting into wood block printmaking though and I just ordered some carving tools – albeit with the intention of creating some merch!

I do have a part-time day job assembling and setting up banjos for Pisgah Banjo here in Asheville – but it’s the most music-related day job I’ve ever had. When I’m done setting up a banjo part of my job is playing it to make sure the set up feels good, which I always enjoy. I also do a bit of private music teaching.

What would a perfect day as an artist and creator look like to you?

I usually need a lot of uninterrupted solo time to really get into a creative flow. It’s also super helpful when I can put my computer and phone away for the day and replace them with poetry books and/or nature walks. And as much as I love being out in nature, I must admit I would still want to retain my creature comforts. I’m envisioning waking up in a cozy cabin close to a lake, stream, or river. I’d come to consciousness feeling well-rested, listening to the sounds of insects and birds and the laughter of the water. Maybe it’s raining softly on the roof? But then the sun comes out, and it’s a perfect 75 degree day, breezy. I’d give myself ample time to rest and take breaks throughout the day, swim, exercise, cook, and eat delicious food… sign me up!


Photo Credit: Rita Kovtun

Mason Lively on Only Vans with Bri Bagwell

Fresh off a new full length album, country and Americana singer-songwriter Mason Lively joins the show to chat with host Bri Bagwell about songwriting, priorities, babies, and the housing market. Do yourself a favor and check out Mason’s new record, Burn The Ground, today!

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Find Mason’s music, podcast, tour dates and merchandise here.

Thanks to our sponsors for this episode, The MusicFest at Steamboat, Lakeside Tax & CH Lonestar Promo!


Editor’s Note: Only Vans with Bri Bagwell is the latest addition to the BGS Podcast Network! Read more about the podcast coming on board here. Find our episode archive here.

Jeffrey Foucault Remembers Billy Conway with The Universal Fire

In our episode with Wisconsin-born, New England-based Jeffrey Foucault, we had a handful of questions for the singer-songwriter about his background: coffee, the Midwest, and Mark Twain wisdom. Then, we talked about Billy Conway for more than an hour. Conway was Foucault’s long-time partner in music, his drummer, and best friend who died from cancer in 2021. He was a roots rock and roll legend in Boston with his tenure in Morphine and Treat Her Right. Conway was like a holy man, known for his creative, curious, and infectious spirit where even people who met him only one time (myself included) were quite taken and inspired by his presence. His loss hit the music community hard. In 2023, a tribute album showcasing the songwriting of Conway recorded by some of his closest friends (including Chris Smither, Foucault, Kris Delmhorst, and Billy’s wife Laurie Sargent) was released. And now, with his latest album release, Jeff’s given us a working wake for his friend Billy, The Universal Fire.

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Elsewhere in the episode, we talked about what was going on with Jeff when he met and started working with Billy in 2013. What state of mind made this spectacular friendship and collaboration completely click? Jeff has also been conscious about his reaction to Conway’s death and processing grief, when it comes to being an example for his teenage daughter (who is also getting into folk music and live performance, too – hi, Hazel!)

We also dig into the new album. Jeffrey paralleled the loss of Billy Conway with a different type of loss, the 2008 fire at the Universal Studios lot in California that destroyed master tapes of hugely influential American recordings. And finally, we check in on how Jeffrey’s human-ness is faring in the high-tech world in the year 2024.


Photo Credit: Joe Navas

Amos Lee on Friends, Femininity and Folk Roots

Throughout his music career, singer-songwriter Amos Lee has cultivated a large female fanbase and also owes a lot of his early start to Norah Jones (a female!). He’s about to hit the road co-headlining with folk music and queer icons the Indigo Girls. In our conversation, he talks about the atmosphere he’s going for in concert, and it’s not a very bro-centered vibe. His latest album Transmissions further proves his case with a gorgeous sonic palette that includes country music, indie folk, folk rock and acoustic music sounds. Recorded with his longtime band in a studio in rural Marlboro, New York, the songs came out as warm as the reclaimed church wood it was built out of.

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Amos dives into topics like how he feels about kids, to his work with cancer patients, to the benefits of caring for your mental health and music. He touches on anxiety and overstimulation (a topic mostly prompted by my anxiety!) and overcoming adversity. He also talks about being a mentor for the Black Opry residency at WXPN in his town of Philadelphia, and explains what a Hoagiemouth is. Amaze and delight at the wonderful Amos Lee.


Photo Credit: Anthony Mulcahy

Basic Folk: Maya, Nina, and Lyle de Vitry

Maya, Nina, and Lyle de Vitry’s life, beginning in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, has been music and family, festivals, old-time, songwriting, and folk. The de Vitry siblings (including sister Monica, currently teaching art in Western Mass) grew up amongst music and nature in their rural home and even had a family band called Old-Time Liberation Front. Many jams around the campfire, music lessons, and encouragement from their parents lead all three siblings to careers surrounding indie folk music – and jazz! (Thank you, Nina.)

All three have released albums in the past year: Maya’s new album The Only Moment is her fourth record in only six years of performing solo in her post-Stray Birds career. Lyle just released his debut album, Door Within a Dream, while simultaneously working alongside other banjo makers at the Pisgah Banjo Company, his current day job. Nina’s excellent debut, What You Feel is Real, came out last year, but she’s been busy lately playing on the Noah Kahan tour as “the utility player.” Nina’s singing harmonies and playing fiddle, mandolin, banjo, guitar, and 12-string guitar while finding creative inspiration from the energy of the crowds and her new found musician siblings in Kahan’s band.

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In our special Basic Folk conversation with the de Vitry sibs, we talk about how they feel about each other’s creative processes, songwriter practices, and musical inspirations. They get into how being at all these music festivals and jams as kids bonded them together and we learn about made-up words that their family uses to this day – stay tuned to find out what a “butchabee” and a “taffy bub” is.

Elsewhere in the episode, they each talk about how disconnected they feel from the mainstream – Nina had never heard of Noah Kahan’s music until she was asked to audition for his band. Also, Lyle gets into how being around three sisters, female musicians, and female songwriters has impacted him and his musicality.

Don’t miss a very special de Vitry “Which One” lightning round wrapping up one of the most special singer-songwriter interviews we’ve done on Basic Folk.


Photo Credit: Chase Denton

Basic Folk: Denitia

Sometimes it strikes me just how much power can emanate from a creative mind. Speaking with Denitia was one of those times. When the indie music artist comes across an unfamiliar musical concept, she goes “sponge mode” until she understands it. Then she seamlessly integrates it into her artistic vocabulary. This relentless curiosity and sense of play can be heard across Denitia’s catalog, from her early work as half of the New York indie R&B duo denitia and sene to her breakthrough 2022 country album, Highways. Her fluency across multiple genres gives her a refreshing approach to record-making, sound, and fashion alike (from her New York streetwear days to thrifting vintage clothes in Nashville).

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Since moving to Nashville and pivoting from R&B to indie country, Denitia has been grabbing audiences’ attention with her gorgeous voice and catchy-as-hell, cool girl indie songwriting. Denitia was selected for the CMT Next Women of Country Class of 2024, and her forthcoming album, Sunset Drive (out September 6), delivers on the hype. Denitia and her longtime songwriting partner, Brad Allen Williams, have painted classic country landscapes against which tales of escape from the ordinary are told with longing and warmth. The new record is something of a full-circle moment for the Texas-born artist and a showcase for her prodigious talents as a vocalist.

Basic Folk co-host Lizzie No leads the conversation in our interview with Denitia, where she offers music industry insights, vocal warm-up techniques, and music marketing strategies.


Photo Credit: Chase Denton