The Value of Letting Go: Ani DiFranco Steps Out of Her Comfort Zone

Releasing a new album is stressful enough for most artists, but releasing an album, a documentary, and a book almost simultaneously – while singing and dancing in a Broadway musical? That sounds crazy even to Ani DiFranco, who released her 23rd album, Unprecedented Sh!t, in May, while performing as Persephone in Hadestown, reprising the role she sang on the same-titled Anais Mitchell album that became the folk opera. (The album was released in 2010 on DiFranco’s Righteous Babe Records label; the show opened on Broadway in 2019 and won eight Tony Awards, including Best Musical and Best Original Score.) DiFranco wrapped her nearly five-month acting debut on June 30, just after performing at the Tribeca Film Festival premiere of director Dana Flora’s documentary, 1-800-ON-HER-OWN, filmed as DiFranco recorded her 2021 album, Revolutionary Love.

On August 27, DiFranco will release her second children’s book, the timely and inspiring lyrical narrative, Show Up and Vote, illustrated by Rachelle Baker. (Her first, The Knowing, was released in 2023.) For most of these endeavors, including Unprecedented Sh!t – only her second album produced by someone else (BJ Burton) – DiFranco did something she’s not used to: giving up control.

Who decides to be in a play, release an album and a book and have a documentary premiere at the same time?

Ani DiFranco: No one would decide that. That’s fate just laughing at me, just fucking with me. But it’s exciting. It’s exhausting. And my hamstrings may or may not hold me up through it all. [Laughs] But I wouldn’t be anywhere else.

Obviously, you’ve spent time in front of audiences. What’s different about doing it in a musical?

I’ve realized that performance has, at least for me, two big components. One is improvisational; it’s of the moment. It’s interactive. The other is putting on the show. I’ve always leaned into the interaction and improvisation. This is very much leaning in the other direction. Doing the same shit every night, eight times a week, for months, is a whole other approach. … What I think I love most about this super unique experience, besides the work itself – Hadestown is such an epic work, and I couldn’t think more highly of it – I’ve never done something where it’s such a group effort. I really have been amazed by [the] collective experience. Like we all became one organism, sort of this collective energy field.

Do you think you would get involved in another production like this?

I’m pretty open to anything. I’m most enamored by the new and terrifying, so I have no idea.

I would think a documentary is exciting, too.

Yeah. Yes …

You don’t sound so sure.

I’m just going with exciting as the adjective. [Laughs] For me, it’s very disconcerting.

In what way?

I actually haven’t seen it and I’m not sure if I will. It’s a lot, to show yourself.

That’s got to be a challenge. But you have led what I consider to be a singular life and have had a really impactful career. It seems like it would make sense to put that onscreen.

It’s not a career-defining, expansive retrospective. Of course, there’s some historical context. But it’s just a walk in the shoes of a woman who’s trying to be an artist in the world, and also a mother and have a relationship and be accountable to everyone that wants her to be at any given moment.

Let’s talk about the voting book. I’m so charmed by the concept, because it’s such an important one to teach. What inspired you to do that?

Exactly what you said. I feel like young people being inspired to vote in this country, in this moment, is the difference between having a democracy tomorrow and not. So when I was invited to make a book for children, I thought, “Hey, maybe I’ll try to talk to some future voters.” It’s from a kid’s point of view about going to vote with her mom. The book is a tool with which parents can engage their kids about voting.

I’m somebody who takes my kids with me to vote so that they see it modeled, so that they understand it as a part of being grown and a member of a society. But even more than a teaching tool, I hope that it will inspire kids, that it will get them excited about this thing that they get to do when they’re grown up, because they’re part of a democracy. It’s a really important, empowering, profound thing that connects them to everybody else, and is a way that we take care of each other, a way that we express our love for each other, and all of these really cool things. I guess I most hope that it lights a fire in a kid.

That brings me to the album. I noticed that “The Thing at Hand” and “The Knowing” seem to share similar concepts, but the latter one apparently was describing the ideas to a child. Is there a connection?

They are very related, but “The Knowing,” I wrote specifically to a child. When I was faced with making my first children’s book, I was having a hard time, and the only way I made it through was to pick up my guitar and make a song that was also a book. And “The Thing at Hand,” those themes of identity and ego, and the vast realms that exist beneath that or beyond it, are themes that run through the record.

I totally caught that, and I loved the lyric, “I defy being defined”; that sums up a lot of your career – and your life. How hard has it been to maintain that stance in a society and music industry that seem to be all about definitions, and judging based on them?

It’s been really hard, every step of the way. People want to define and describe you in very finite terms, and they’re often very reductive. Holding onto a sense of myself as this ever-changing field of infinite possibility, so to speak, is a hard thing to do. There are pressures from every direction to be something very concrete, that thing that this person or that person or the other wants you to be or insists that you are. It’s been a real dance of negotiating that all the way along.

What do you do when it gets really frustrating?

I’ve had to just develop this – I mean, I’m as thin-skinned as the next guy, when it comes right down to it. I am as lost in seeking affirmation from the world around me instead of from inside myself as the next guy, so it’s a constant challenge to go beyond all of that and to keep yourself at a distance, no matter what the world is saying about you. I’ve learned that you can’t rely on the world to tell you that you’re worthy and you’re good and you’re great and you’re wonderful, which sometimes it does, because then when it turns around and says you’re unworthy, you’re terrible, you’re horrible, you’re a sham, your whole premise of yourself comes crumbling down. So it’s still a challenge that I am trying to rise to, to self-love. The older I get, the more I believe that the ways that we harm each other all come home to our lack of self-love. So it’s not some kind of trite endeavor; it’s not self-centered or indulgent. It is extremely important to peace on earth that we learn to find our inherent worthiness within ourselves in order that we not turn our self-hatred on each other.

Back to the concepts you address in these songs. “New Bible” sounds almost like a manifesto; there’s so much to unpack there. In other songs, you just allude to an idea; for instance, in “Baby Roe,” you say, “I think we might be wrong about all of that,” which raises the question, wrong about what?

That’s another song that is interrelated on the theme of ego and identity; it’s … stepping back from this debate about abortion and reproductive freedom and going, this is ridiculous. Like, projecting your ego onto a potential human; it’s like, I am a being of light. I am consciousness and that’s what you are. And this is one of many, many lives and manifestations of this unified field of consciousness that unites us all, that we are coming from and returning to infinitely, that we are all one within. This idea that consciousness need be born right now, into this exact body, in order to be manifesting, is really silly. The whole premise of forced reproduction is based in this very stunted understanding of what we are and what life is and what death is. I think a lot of the traps that we fall into that are entrapping us more and more, sociopolitically, environmentally – it’s all ego-based delusion.

In many of these songs, you sing so sweetly, and yet there’s these undertones, like in “More or Less Free.” I was surprised to read that was about somebody in prison; I thought of it as possibly directed to oppressors.

“More or Less Free” is intentionally open-ended, but yes, it’s written from within prison walls, as a free person inside a prison, visiting and having very human moments and connections with people who live in cages all the time. But it’s a tricky business to talk about songs and what is this about and what is that about? I hate doing that, because songs are supposed to reach you the way they reach you and you’re supposed to hear what you hear, or not. And that’s not for me to say, really. They’re about what you decide they are.

But you know what I’m saying. Technically, that’s where it comes from, but it is very much about being born into a society, that dichotomy of – we are all born free, as my friend Utah Phillips would say, and then you wait for somebody to come along and try to take away that freedom. He always said the degree to which you resist is the degree to which you are free. So yeah, we are all born free, and yet, we’re not. That’s all that it’s about.

What was different about doing an album with somebody else calling the shots?

Everything of this particular record and process was unique. The remote thing, for one, which is just how it worked out. He and I would have loved to have spent endless hours in a room together vibing off each other, but we did it interacting through many levels of machines. In retrospect, that’s maybe exactly apropos for a record where I was really trying to bring the machines in. BJ, of course, is the one with the machines and the facility to be intuitive and creative with them, but we sort of worked vicariously with each other.

Because I was not in the room with him, I couldn’t say, “Ooh, a little to the left. Oh, a little louder.” It was like, I record the songs, he fucks with them royally, and what comes back is – I mean, we had a little back and forth, but really, it was overwhelmingly a process of giving over. Just saying yes to his artistry, like he was saying yes to mine. I was not prepared to do [that] at 20 or 30 or 40, and with album one or six or 10. But this is album 23. I’m 53 years old, and I’m more than ready to say yes and really delegate.

People have gone back and redone previous albums. Maybe 10 years from now, you might decide that you want to redo it.

Well, I’ve been in this music game and song-making game for 30-plus years, and one thing that I’ve learned from experience is that songs have long lives. And, that even when I was in charge and doing everything “the way I thought it should be done,” which was most of those other records, I don’t necessarily “get it right,” or the album version is not the definitive version of any song of mine, necessarily. In fact, I have no memory of making any of them. And sometimes when I hear them, I’m like, “Whoa, what?” because the song as it’s lived onstage and in the world is not necessarily that moment. When I had misgivings about BJ’s tendency to turn my guitar into some other sound, or eliminate it altogether, or sort of deconstruct what I sent him or something, I would think, “Whoa, is this cool?” And then I was thinking, “Well, who cares? That’s just how it sounds on this little piece of vinyl.” The song, it’s like a snapshot of a human; the human has many faces.

I love the line in “Unprecedented Sh!t,” “the bigger the heart, the more it bleeds.” But it also sounds like there’s an attempt to ignore that [i.e., “I got a lot of heart/ But I can’t afford to let it bleed”]. Sometimes, for example, with animal rescue, I have to stop myself from reading another story about this poor …

Oh, yeah. Dude. That’s all I’m talking about there, is how much we have to numb ourselves to survive being surrounded by pain and suffering and feeling helpless, if not being helpless, to stop it.

It’s a shame that we have to numb ourselves, but on the other hand, do you ever feel like that character in The Green Mile, where it’s just all going into you, and it’s too much to hold sometimes?

Yes, very much. I think anybody whose heart is not dead inside their chest is trying to deal with that.

That’s what I got from “New Bible,” too. There are some really pessimistic statements in there, but there’s also some real optimistic ones, a sense of, yeah, you can let this stuff overwhelm you, or you can look for ways to do something. That, to me, is a really good thing to put out there.

Yeah. Which brings us back around to the children’s book. The tools of nonviolent revolution are right there in our pocket, actually. What do you know? What do you know?


Photo Credit: Anthony Mulcahy

Brat Summer Hits Bluegrass – Everything You Need To Know

Brat summer has come to bluegrass music – like seemingly every other corner of our culture. This viral social media sensation continues to mystify internet scrollers, news anchors, journalists, and analysts of certain generations, but the trend – based on the wildly popular hyperpop/dance album, brat, released by DJ and pop star Charli XCX in June – has found a sure footing in one perhaps unlikely corner of the music industry: bluegrass.

This fact was no more evident to the editorial staff at BGS than at our A Bluegrass Situation after show at Newport Folk Festival  last month, where recent BGS Artist of the Month and banjo magnate Tony Trischka posed an earth-shattering question to the cavalcade of bluegrass and roots music stars waiting backstage: “Who here is brat?”

Reactions were mixed. Trischka and his cohort attempted to explain “brat” to the gathered artists and comedians; those with knowledge of the conversation hesitated to identify who among the star-studded lineup identified as “brat” to Trischka and who did not, out of respect for those present.

 

View this post on Instagram

 

A post shared by Hawktail (@hawktailband)

While our Newport Folk Festival lineup may have been an organic blend of brat and non-brat, elsewhere in the roots scene critically-acclaimed and award winning artists, pickers, and bands have gleefully brought brat to the forefront of a busy bluegrass festival and music camp season with many videos and posts celebrating brat summer. Impeccable instrumentalists, GRAMMY and IBMA Award nominees and winners, and industry leaders have all been seen making posts, referencing brat, and doing viral accompanying dance moves for XCX’s “Apple.” Meanwhile, new acoustic string band supergroup Hawktail have declared it’s a “Britt summer,” instead, celebrating their bandmate, fiddler Brittany Haas.

Do you or someone you know identify as brat? Are you, too, enjoying a bratgrass summer? You aren’t alone. These bluegrass artists and bands are certainly brat. And, with a few more weeks left before we usher in fall, there’s still plenty of time for bratgrass to continue to entrance and enlighten the bluegrass community.

Sister Sadie

@sistersadiemusic We’re practicing up on our dance moves for our set here at Rocky Grass 🏔️✨ we can’t wait to see y’all out there 💓🍏 #rockygrass #charlixcx #apple #sistersadie #ootd @jaelee @maddie 🫧🫶 @Gena Britt @Dani Flowers @Deanie Richardson ♬ Apple – Charli xcx

Look, we already knew Sister Sadie are brat, because No Fear = brat. The transitive property applies. Brat brat brat. Whatever this legendary lineup tackles, from exciting covers to TikTok dance trends, we’re here for it. Bratgrass epitomized. No notes, very demure. Very cutesy.

Maddie Witler

@maddiewitler 🍏 🍏 so fun my first ever tiktok dance video and a reason to wear this dress that I always chicken out on @Charli XCX dance by @Kelley Heyer #charlixcx #apple #theapple #brat #pop #fyp #trend #dance #pride #cat ♬ Apple – Charli xcx

Mandolinist, instructor, multi-instrumentalist, and coffee expert Maddie Witler was one of the very first bluegrass adopters of brat – some would argue, even well before the eponymous album. Witler has toured and performed with so many of bluegrass’s greats from all across the genre map, and now has crafted a vibrant online presence and business through TikTok, Patreon, and, of course, bringing the “Apple” dance and brat chartreuse to bluegrass.

Missy Raines & Allegheny, The Onlies, and More

@snooplemcdoople Old time brat summer #bratsummer #oldtime #missyraines @Tristan Scroggins @viv.and.riley @TheOnlies ♬ Apple – Charli xcx

Missy Raines is one of the winningest musicians in the history of the IBMA. Clearly, Raines is also brat. Here, she and members of her band, Allegheny (Ellie Hakanson and Tristan Scroggins), are joined by the Onlies (Sami Braman, Vivian Leva, Riley Calcagno, Leo Shannon) as well as several other instructors and musicians at Targhee Music Camp in Alta, Wyoming in the Grand Tetons. Sounds plenty brat to us!

Seth Taylor

 

View this post on Instagram

 

A post shared by Seth Taylor (@sethtaylor427)

In-demand guitarist and multi-instrumentalist Seth Taylor currently tours with Sarah Jarosz, bringing brat with them everywhere they go. Or, should we say, “brat paisley summer.” Which, naturally, we’ve gone ahead and agreed is 100% a thing. Taylor is a bluegrass shredder who’s performed and recorded with countless artists and bands in country, Americana, folk, and beyond. Plus, his tasty acoustic guitar cover of Sabrina Carpenter’s “Please Please Please” feels pretty brat to us, too.

While we wish we could report a Pickin’ on Brat album is currently in the works or that Charli XCX will launch surprise bluegrass remixes with a Sierra Ferrell feature verse coming soon, rest assured the BGS team will continue to monitor, address, and report on the very important issue of bratgrass to our audience and readers – brat or not.

As more and more TikTok trends and hits from the current pop and Top 40 charts filter into string band music – like Taylor Ashton or Sister Sadie covering Chappell Roan, Seth Taylor’s “Please Please Please” rendition, Molly Tuttle singing Beyoncé, and many more examples crossing our feeds daily – it’s clear this bratgrass summer is first and foremost for the demure and mindful rootsy girls, gays, theys, and every brat in between.


 

The National Parks Embody Natural Majesty on ‘Wild Spirit’

Since 2013, The National Parks have embodied their name in a way few other bands can. In fact, they’ve made a mission of translating the breathtaking majesty of the outdoors into awe-inspiring roots pop – music that ends up like oxygen for the soul, especially if you happen to be lost in a concrete jungle.

A Provo, Utah-based quartet featuring Brady Parks, Sydney Macfarlane, Cam Brannelly, and Megan Parks, the band have explored all over the stylistic trail map in the past, but their new LP Wild Spirit (out August 23) marks a return to base camp. Back to resonate wood-and-string soundscapes, soaring harmonies, and rivers of rushing energy. These days, their brand of upbeat jangle pop is brighter, more encouraging, and more connected to the rhythm of nature than ever.

Speaking with BGS about Wild Spirit’s creation, primary songwriter and guitarist/frontman Brady explains where the mix of uplifting vibes and down-to-earth instruments comes from – and why the group’s new tunes feel like sunrise after a long night.

You’re 10+ years into the band at this point. How’s everybody feeling creatively these days?

Brady Parks: We’re feeling really good. I feel like this new album was kind of just a beautiful process, start to finish. It was, in a way stepping back to our roots – a little more folky, there’s some country elements, some bluegrass, and so it really just feels like rediscovering us. It was just a really fun project to do.

Once you get that far down the road, at some point you have to loop back around and remember what you were doing in the first place, right?

Totally. I mean, we’ve definitely dipped our feet into going more pop at times, and including those elements, so it was fun to bring everything we’ve done over the course of our career back to our roots.

Tell me a little bit about those roots. You seem to capture these natural themes and sounds within the music – the sway of trees in the wind, the rush of a river. Has that always been with you?

Totally. I feel like nature has always been a huge part of my songwriting. I grew up in Colorado and living in the mountains, I just loved it. I was outside all the time. And now living Utah for the last 13 or so years, just being surrounded by so much natural beauty, I tend to find a lot of parallels between love and life and nature, and how it all comes together.

I think it’s always been really inspiring to me musically – and also not musically, just in general. So I think it’s always naturally played a role in our music. And then over the years as we kind of discovered who we are more and more and more with each project, I think it’s become a bit more intentional. We want our music to inspire people to get outside. We want to capture what it feels like.

What do you think is so intriguing about that connection between nature and the human soul? Is there wisdom in slowing down and just learning to look around?

Yeah, and this is something that we talk about all the time as a band when we’re feeling overwhelmed, or depressed, or anxious, or anything. The thing that grounds us the most is getting outside, and it helps us recenter ourselves. I don’t know, I think when you’re out on a hike or you’re out in nature doing something, your soul kind of connects to something bigger than yourself, and it helps you breathe again. I think that’s a big thing for all of us in the band.

Wild Spirit arrives August 23. Tell me, from the band’s perspective, what do you think makes this one a little bit different?

I think this album comes from a lot of soul searching, a lot of going through different personal things. This album captures what it’s like to get lost, and then what it feels like to find yourself when you’re lost. … When I was writing this album, I was working through all those things that I’ve been going through and kind of had this picture in my mind of a forest at night and being lost in it, and what it is to be terrified in this darkness, this unknown, this uncertainty. But also when you’re lost, the daylight comes and you start hiking up and you get different vantage point, and you see things clearer and see the beauty in the journey of it all.

During the writing process, was there a moment where things started to coalesce?

There was definitely a moment pretty early on that we kind of hit on, “This is what the album is, this is what it’s going to feel like, this is what it’s going to narratively be about.” And that was when I was writing “Wild Spirit.” I actually wrote that in Nashville, and it was just one of those writes that was super inspiring and [I] walked away from it really excited to re-listen to this song a million times. I sent it to the band after – I actually sent a group of songs – and that was the one song that everyone was like, whoa, “Wild Spirit.”

Tell me about “Timber.” I love mixing the natural theme with the romantic idea of falling like a tree in love. Where did that come from?

That was written as a love song to my wife Megan, who plays violin in the band. It was a song about letting go of anything that was holding me back and not in our relationship, but I mean, just candidly, we’ve been going through some stuff with our faith and our journey in that aspect. And yeah, this was a song about letting go of everything we’ve known and trust falling with each other, and just realizing that this is what is important to us – our relationship and each other. And that’s all. You just kind of let go of the roots that hold you and fall, and I think there’s a lot of beauty in that.

There’s some wonderful duet harmony on “Where You Are.” Can you tell me where that song came from?

“Where You Are” was a song I wrote about feeling kind of stuck in between places. Sometime I feel this “in-between” in life, coming out of something and moving into something else. Like antsy to get going again, and it was a song I wrote to myself like, “Hey, you can get where you’re going, but it’s okay to be where you’re at right now.” So it’s kind of a song about knowing that one day you’ll get to where you need to go, but it’s okay to not be there.

How about “Scenic Route”? This one is really beautiful to me and lyrically full of natural references. Spiritually speaking, do you tend to choose the scenic route? Or are you more of a direct to the point kind of guy?

I would say I’ve been a direct to the point kind of guy most of my life. And now I feel like more on the scenic route of things, just enjoying life, enjoying the things that matter and trying to slow it down. “Scenic Route” actually is one of the first songs I wrote for the record when I was still trying to figure out thematically what to do, and I really wrote it about Meg and being on a journey together. No matter what hard times we go through, again, it’s about leaning on the person that matters most to you and slowing it down and just enjoying life, even through uncertainty.

Big picture, I’m just wondering what you hope people take away from this one?

I just hope this album in particular can help people that are feeling lost, that are feeling confused, that feel stuck. I hope they know that they’re not alone and that it’s okay to be where you’re at. And then I also hope it can uplift musically. A big part of our brand and messaging is to inspire people to look at the world around them, to get outside and see the beauty in life. So I think those would be the main takeaways.


Photo courtesy of the artist.

Mixtape: Yarn’s Songs Of and About Pop Culture

I make a lot of references in Yarn’s music about other bands, artists, movies, actors, etc… I didn’t realize how much until I started working on this Mixtape.  Just a few of the things I mention are Jim Croce, Dolly Parton, The Allman Brothers, George Burns, Bob Wills, Waylon Jennings, Velvet Underground, Rex Moroux – and the list goes on. This Mixtape will include references to other artists, food, and places famous in the world of pop culture during its given time of release. – Blake Christiana, Yarn

“Play Freebird” – Yarn

I figured I’d start and end with two of our songs from our new album, Born, Blessed, Grateful & Alive. My wife started writing this one about her father and I took it over and finished it. The entire song is based around another super famous song that Mandy’s dad used to play around the house when she was a kid. And now, if anyone yells out ‘Free Bird’ at one of our concerts, we’ve got something to give ’em.

“You Never Even Called Me By Name” – David Allen Coe

Such a perfect song for this Mixtape. Coe even impersonates the singers he references in this song as well as poking fun at the entire country music genre. Pretty brilliant. Waylon Jennings, Charley Pride, Merle Haggard, and he even references his own name.

“Calling Elvis” – Dire Straits

We could do a giant Mixtape with songs that just reference Elvis alone. I love this one, because just about every lyric is a reference to Elvis and the songs he recorded. Also, Mark Knopfler is THE MAN. More Elvis to come on this list.

“Bette Davis Eyes” – Kim Carnes

I had to include a quintessential ’80s tune on here and this is it. Great voice on Kim Carnes, the perfect sultry rasp. Of course she references the actress, Bette Davis, as well as Greta Garbo.

“Mrs. Robinson” – Simon & Garfunkel

Here’s one with a sports icon reference. Paul Simon has done a lot of these kinds of references in his songs, too, and I’ll include one of those later in the tape. Joe DiMaggio, the famous New York Yankee who married Marilyn Monroe, is mentioned here as ‘Joltin’ Joe.’

“Candle In The Wind” – Elton John

Nice little transition here from The Yankee Clipper to Marilyn Monroe. This entire song is written about Monroe.

“Man on The Moon” – R.E.M.

Lots of references here, but the main star of the song is Andy Kaufman, the brilliant comedian who starred in Taxi in the ’70s. Love Andy Kaufman and R.E.M. Great song. Other honorable pop-culture mentions in this song are 21, Checkers, Chess, and of course Elvis. Also a great Elvis impression from Michael Stipe.

“Nobody Home” – Pink Floyd

The Wall might have been my favorite album as a kid. And in this particular song off that album, Roger Waters sings ‘the obligatory Hendrix perm,’ a direct reference to Jimi Hendrix and his hair style. Glad I got to include Pink Floyd on here. Beautiful song.

“Walkin’ In Memphis” – Marc Cohn

This song just had to be on here. More Elvis for ya, along with WC Handy, Beale Street, Al Green, and more. Another fantastic song.

“Graceland” – Paul Simon

What do you know, more Elvis. I think I need to write a song about Elvis now. This song is too good, it paints a picture as good as any song ever written. Enough said.

“Dairy Queen” – Indigo Girls

I thought we needed some pop-culture food references, so I included these next two songs. Not to mention, Indigo Girls and Amy Ray are my wife’s favorites. Amy Ray’s recent solo records have all been really great and everyone should have a listen.

“Factory” – Band of Horses

I love this tune and its reference to the candy of my youth, Now and Laters. To me, Band of Horses is like a modern day Beach Boys. Great band, great songs, and great harmonies. This song reminds me how half my life is spent in a hotel room.

“I Want You” – Yarn

I reference the 1980 movie, Honeysuckle Rose, with Willie Nelson & Diane Cannon. Not sure anyone saw it, but it’s about an affair on the road between musicians Nelson and Cannon, and the song itself follows a similar plot line. I wrote this song with my longtime writing partner, Shane Spaulding.


Photo Credit: Bob Adamek

BGS 5+5: Rose Gerber

Artist: Rose Gerber
Hometown: Portland, Oregon
Latest Album: Untraveled Highway

Genre is dead (long live genre!), but how would you describe the genres and styles your music inhabits?

I like to describe my music as rock meets country, though I have some ’90s alternative and pop influences in there. To mash all those up into one genre, I settle on calling it alt-country.

How often do you hide behind a character in a song or use “you” when it’s actually “me?”

All the time. It’s almost impossible to exclusively divorce my own emotions and experience when creating a character. It’s very freeing, though, and I like to weave in and out of not just the character’s perspective, but the perspectives of other people I know, too, as well as mine.

What’s the toughest time you ever had writing a song?

I wrote a song called “Back of My Mind,” which is about my father who passed away when I was young. I cried my way through writing it and relived a lot of the grief I hadn’t felt in years.

What is a genre, album, artist, musician, or song that you adore that would surprise people?

I love Enya. I put it on when I am super stressed, need to fall asleep, or just want to feel some mystical vibes. Last time I visited Ireland, I fulfilled a dream and put it on full blast as I drove along the Irish west coast taking in the scenery.

Does pineapple really belong on pizza?

I fought it for so long and one day I was high and hungry enough to be talked into it. It was an instant love affair. I’ve since branched out into being open to other fruits on a pizza. Fig, pear… though I might draw the line at watermelon.


Photo Credit: Whitney Lyons Photography.

Saddle Up and Get to Know the Artists Behind ‘Cowboy Carter’

On March 29, Beyoncé rode sidesaddle onto the world stage and took us all by storm with the release of her eighth studio album, Cowboy Carter.

Cowboy Carter arrived as the second installment of a three-act project that commenced with Renaissance in 2022. Renaissance incorporated house, disco, hyperpop, R&B, and funk while reclaiming the Black queer roots of dance music. On Cowboy Carter, she similarly reclaims the Black roots of country, blending it with folk, rock, R&B, hip-hop, classical, house, and gospel throughout.

Prior to the release of Cowboy Carter, country has been a longstanding muse for Beyoncé. While her affiliation with the genre was popularized by Lemonade’s “Daddy Lessons,” her first country-leaning performance dates back to nearly a decade earlier when she performed “Irreplaceable” with Sugarland at the American Music Awards in 2007.

Potent and impeccably saturated, Cowboy Carter makes clear that country is inarguably a huge part of Beyoncé’s creative and cultural identity. However, her presence in the genre has not always been well-received; in an Instagram caption 10 days before the album’s release, Beyoncé revealed that CC was largely inspired by an experience where she “did not feel welcomed” into the country fold. Many speculate that this refers to her appearance at the 2016 CMA Awards. The network received racist backlash after she performed “Daddy Lessons” with the Chicks, prompting the erasure of the song’s video from the show’s website (though a representative from CMA later denied the correlation between those two events).

Of Cowboy Carter Beyoncé writes, “The criticisms I faced when I first entered this genre forced me to propel past the limitations that were put on me.”

Beyoncé alchemizes a multitude of influences and collaborators across the gargantuan album in order to achieve the monumental musical feats of CC. With a credits list that sprawls for seemingly miles, Beyoncé enlists a number of guest artists, co-writers, producers, and musicians. Between them, they represent the Black roots of country, pay tribute to Black Americans’ impact on the genre, include legendary country artists and well-known side musicians and collaborators that assert the project’s roots in country, and represent the bright and diverse present and future of country by featuring several lesser-known Black country artists, many of which are also genre-bending in their own work.

In a list that is by no means comprehensive, here are just a few of the contributors that brought their musical magic to Cowboy Carter.

Rhiannon Giddens

“Texas Hold ‘Em” made history as the first hit single by a solo Black woman to top the Billboard’s Hot Country Songs Chart and 10 weeks later, as of this writing, it maintains its gilded perch. Fittingly, the song opens with the warmth and drive of the legendary Rhiannon Giddens strumming a standalone fretless, clawhammer gourd banjo. The talented multi-instrumentalist, singer, composer of many mediums, and roots scholar also sprinkles notes of viola throughout the track.

It is no coincidence that Giddens’ banjo playing, like much of her work, pays homage to the lineage of Black influence throughout roots music. Referred to by many as a “performing historian,” Giddens has spent her career shedding light upon the cross-cultural interweavings of the genre. Here, in an interview, she details the West African origins of the banjo, an instrument essential to American country music that was initially brought to the Americas by enslaved Black folks who used gourds and other accessible materials to recreate instruments of their homelands. By showcasing Giddens on the track, Beyoncé introduces a sonic representative of overlooked histories while uplifting one of the most celebrated Black musicians in modern day roots music.

Robert Randolph

Raised in a secluded religious community, Robert Randolph grew up without secular music. The renowned pedal steel guitarist heard only the music played within the House of God Church of Orange, New Jersey, for decades. He learned the instrument through Sacred Steel, a Black gospel tradition developed in the ’30s that highlighted the steel guitar during religious services.

During his early adulthood, Randolph became exposed to the world of music beyond; as he absorbed jazz, blues, funk, rock, and soul, he soon set out layering his gorgeous pedal steel tones upon a fusion of genres, particularly alongside his band, Robert Randolph and the Family Band. Across his musical arc, he epitomizes Beyoncé’s philosophy that music is transcendent; “All music is related,” he says. “Gospel is the same as blues. The only thing that changes is hardcore gospel people are singing about God and Jesus and in the blues people are singing about ‘my baby left me’ and whiskey.”

Justin Schipper

Like Robert Randolph, Justin Schipper is also credited for steel guitar on the track “16 Carriages.” A Nashville-based composer, multi-instrumentalist, songwriter, and producer, Schipper is a prominent figure in the current country landscape. His talents have landed him on tour with Josh Turner and Shania Twain (playing pedal steel and dobro), and he has gigged with the likes of Carrie Underwood, Chris Stapleton, Kris Kristofferson, Florida Georgia Line, and more.

Cam

Cam (given name Camaron Ochs) co-produced and co-wrote five songs on CC. An American country singer and songwriter, Cam began her career songwriting for musical giants in the industry such as Sam Smith and Miley Cyrus. Since then, she’s released three of her own studio albums with songs inspired by the songwriting styles of Patsy Cline, Ray Charles, Bonnie Raitt, Willie Nelson, and Joni Mitchell, amongst others. A prominent figure in the current country landscape, Cam lends crucial insights and layers with each of her contributions.

Sean & Sara Watkins

Renowned in the current bluegrass/newgrass scene, this sibling duo lends guitar (Sean) and fiddle (Sara) to the track “II Most Wanted.” Sean and Sara epitomize the familial quality so integral to bluegrass; their first band, Nickel Creek, was formed in 1989 alongside virtuoso Chris Thile when Sara and Chris were only 8 years old and Sean was 12. The siblings have been playing together ever since; Nickel Creek would go on to release seven albums, the latest of which, Celebrants, was released last year.

In 2002, the pair began The Watkins Family Hour as a monthly musical showcase featuring their friends and other collaborators in Los Angeles. Spanning over 20 years, the WFH has blossomed expansively. In fact, the pair released their third studio album, Vol. II, in 2022, a celebration of the project and the community surrounding it. Similarly to CC, the list of features for Vol. II is extensive, featuring the likes of Madison Cunningham, Willie Watson, Jackson Browne, and Fiona Apple, amongst others.

Stevie Wonder

A child prodigy who became blind shortly after birth, Stevie Wonder is widely regarded as one of the most influential musicians of the 20th century. He makes his contribution to CC by layering tasteful harmonica atop the sonically rich layers of “Jolene,” a reimaginative cover in the shape of Dolly Parton’s 1973 classic. Much like Beyoncé herself, Wonder is a trailblazer who, as Beyoncé stated in her Innovator Award speech at the iHeartRadio Awards, “defied any label placed upon [him].” From jazz to soul to funk to R&B to gospel to pop and beyond, Stevie Wonder has influenced and inspired creators across infinite genres and blendings with his vibrant propensity for experimentation. In the same speech, Beyoncé poured out a fountain of gratitude towards the legend, who presented her award —“Thank you so much Stevie, I love you,” she said. “I love you and I honor you. I want to thank you for making a way for all of us. […] Whenever anyone asks me if there’s anyone I can listen to for the rest of my life, it’s always you. So thank you, God bless you.”

Brittney Spencer, Tanner Adell, Tiera Kennedy, and Reyna Roberts

These four women are responsible for the ethereal background and third verse vocals for “Blackbiird.” Additionally, Spencer, Roberts, and Kennedy also lend background vocals to “Tyrant,” while Adell’s voice is woven into the sweeping harmonies of “Ameriican Requiem.”

Initially released in 1968 on The Beatles’ self-titled album, (colloquially known as “The White Album”), Paul McCartney wrote “Blackbird” in response to witnessing on television the harassment and violence that Black students endured upon attending newly-integrated schools. In 2018, he told GQ that he was particularly influenced by the young women who constituted, in part, the Little Rock Nine in Alabama — a nickname for the first nine Black students to desegregate the formerly all-white Central High School in Little Rock, Arkansas.

As McCartney explained to TODAY, “In England, a ‘bird’ is a girl, so I was thinking of a Black girl going through this; now is your time to arise; set yourself free; take these broken wings.”

Within her illustrious arrangement of the classic, Beyoncé pairs the initial guitar track recorded by McCartney with the vocals of herself and these four Black women whose careers are actively altering the historically whitewashed landscape of country. By including them, Beyoncé nods towards McCartney’s intended meaning of the song while actively uplifting these young women so that they may prosper in a genre that undervalues and mistreats the Black artists who continue to give it wings. Brittney Spencer, Tanner Adell, Tiera Kennedy, and Reyna Roberts each have burgeoning careers in the genre that are largely influenced by traditional country sounds and themes.

Willie Nelson & Dolly Parton

In addition to inviting in many Black artists and roots musicians, Beyoncé strategically inserts more commercially successful country greats whose values align with her own. As Willie Nelson tells his faux-radio station listeners in the track “Smoke Hour II,” “Sometimes you don’t know what you like until someone you trust turns you onto some real good shit. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why I’m here.” This line candidly demonstrates an awareness of the unfortunate truth that a vast array of today’s country fans are white listeners unlikely to take this music seriously without ample accreditation from respected white artists.

Merely four days after the release of CC, likely due in part to the inclusion of Willie and Dolly, the number of first-time listeners of Beyoncé’s music had increased by 85% on Spotify.

Willie Nelson, who celebrates his 91st birthday this year, is renowned for his left-leaning activism (especially advocating for the legalization of marijuana — hence the nomenclature of his feature tracks “Smoke Hour” and “Smoke Hour II”) and his role in pioneering the Outlaw Country movement. Outlaw Country began in the ’60s as a subgenre to rebel against the conservative suppressions, sonic and otherwise, of the country industry at the time. Willie and his like-minded contemporaries strove to achieve creative freedom beyond the political and sonic standards that dominated Nashville.

Similarly, Dolly Parton has used her platform, influence, and capital to enact social change. In addition to being an advocate for LGBTQ+ rights, she donated $1 million to Vanderbilt University in 2020 to go towards vaccine research amidst the early stages of the COVID-19 pandemic.

As of 2024, Willie Nelson and Dolly Parton are widely regarded as two of the most successful American country artists of all time. Nelson holds 12 Grammys from 57 nominations, and continues to tour (in fact, he is actively on the road again right now). Dolly has accrued a total of 11 Grammys from 50 nominations over the course of her career and recently gave a dazzling performance at the 2023 NFL Thanksgiving Halftime Show. The amount of esteem and respect each has garnered throughout their careers grants Cowboy Carter a certain amount of credibility within the wider country circuit.

However, it is clear that Beyoncé doesn’t just merely use these two for their name recognition. She is, indubitably, a seasoned scholar in the history of American country music and respects the discography of both artists immensely. While both give narrative voice-overs, Dolly also lends background vocals to “Tyrant” and, of course, shares songwriting credits for the innovative cover of her song “Jolene” that appears on the album.

Willie Jones & Shaboozey

Willie Jones joins Beyoncé on CC to lend his resonant, smoky vocals on the duet track, “Just for Fun,” and to “Jolene.” Having gotten his start as a contestant on the X Factor in 2012, Jones is currently making a name for himself as contemporary Black country artist that Grammy.com refers to as a “country-rap iconoclast.” As proves to be a crucial theme throughout Cowboy Carter, Jones galvanizes cross-genre musings to make a sound that is entirely his own.

Similarly, Shaboozey is a rapping Black country artist who represents the future of the genre. Combining hip-hop, rock, country, and Americana, Shaboozey further embodies the blending spirit behind CC. His contributions to the album include rapping verses on both “Spaghettii” and “Sweet Honey Buckiin.”

Linda Martell

Beyoncé ingeniously laced together Cowboy Carter to demonstrate the past, present, and future of Black musicians who have influenced the American roots music; and Linda Martell stands as a crowned example of the past. Martell, now 82, was the first commercially successful Black woman in country. In 1969, she made history as the first Black woman to play the Grand Ole Opry, and she held the status of highest peaking single by a Black woman on Billboard’s Hot Country Singles Chart for her song “Color Him Father” until Beyoncé’s very own “Texas Hold ‘Em” took its place.

However, Martell’s success was short-lived; she left Nashville and country music altogether in 1974 after receiving racist backlash following the release of her first album. Nearly every live show was corroded by racial slurs from belligerent audiences, and her label eventually shelved her music when her single, “Bad Case of the Blues,” failed to do the numbers they were expecting. As Martell postulates on the CC track “Spaghettii,” “Genres are a funny little concept, aren’t they? In theory, they have a simple definition that’s easy to understand. But in practice, well, some may feel confined.”

While Martell’s career arc fell victim to the confines of hegemonic racism within Nashville (and the country at large), her appearance on Cowboy Carter pays tribute to her historical strides for Black artists nevertheless. The track “The Linda Martell Show” (wherein Martell poses as the host of her own radio show) acts as a foil to Willie Nelson’s “Smoke Hour” — Beyoncé here reimagines the career of Martell, granting her the accreditation to host her own show, something history previously never afforded her.

Miley Cyrus & Post Malone

Beyoncé’s respect for innovation rings loud and clear in her inclusion of Miley Cyrus and Post Malone on CC. Each share a vocal duet with Beyoncé on the album — Miley sings “II Most Wanted” and Post Malone contributes to the track “Levii’s Jeans.”

Though both are primarily known as pop artists, each has a career largely informed by their capacity to genrebend. Miley, daughter of country icon Billy Ray Cyrus and God-daugher of Dolly Parton, adds additional credibility to Beyoncé’s country venture. Throughout her career, Miley has traversed country, rock, pop, and R&B.

Similarly, Post Malone has woven together pop, alternative R&B, hip-hop, and indie throughout his career, and many speculate that he will soon release a country album.

It should be noted that both Miley Cyrus and Post Malone have been able to immerse themselves in genres that are historically Black throughout their respective careers. That both have moved between country and R&B without controversy is telling; their capacity to do so seamlessly and successfully demonstrates how white artists are able to express themselves fluidly without systemic repercussions. It is this very ease that Beyoncé wishes to cultivate for artists of every race; in her Instagram post about the release of the album, she writes, “My hope is that years from now, the mention of an artist’s race, as it relates to releasing genres of music, will be irrelevant.”

Raphael Saddiq

Referred to by music critic Robert Chrisgau as the “preeminent R&B artist of the ’90s,” Raphael Saddiq made mark as an American singer, songwriter, record producer, and multi-instrumentalist. He rose to fame in the ’90s with his R&B/soul group, Tony! Toni! Toné!, and went on to have a successful solo career. Additionally, he has produced songs for musical giants such as Erykah Badu, Stevie Wonder, TLC, D’Angelo, Solange Knowles (Beyoncé’s sister), John Legend, and more.

He is credited 18 times over the course of Cowboy Carter for his producing, writing, and instrumental contributions to the tracklist.


Photo Credit: Mason Poole

WATCH: Max McNown, “Worry ‘Bout My Wandering”

Artist: Max McNown
Hometown: Bend, Oregon
Song: “Worry ‘Bout My Wandering”
Album: Wandering
Release Date: April 12, 2024
Label: Fugitive Recordings x The Orchard

In Their Words: “‘Worry ‘Bout My Wandering’ was probably the most difficult song for me to write as it’s so personal. It came from being far away from my family and thinking about my mom and wondering how she feels about my life and the direction it’s taken. Shooting the video in my beautiful home state of Oregon was very important to me… I just always want to make my family and hometown proud.” – Max McNown

Track Credits:
Produced by AJ Pruis.
Recorded by AJ Pruis at The Chambers, Thompson’s Station, TN.
Editing by AJ Pruis.
Programming & Arrangement by AJ Pruis.
Mixed by John Nathaniel.
Mastered by Sam Moses.

AJ Pruis – Bass
Drew Belk – Guitars, pedal steel, Dobro
Mike Walker – BGVs


Photo Credit: Benjamin Edwards

Video Credits: Directed by Benjamin Edwards
Produced by Hayden W. Larson
B Camera – Micah Reimer
Gaffer – Parker Edwards
Edit / Grade – Edwards Media Co 
Set – Neon Toast 
Guitar – Parker Edwards 
Percussion – Emmanuel Kahn 
Filmed on location in Oregon. 

With a New Album, ‘No Fear,’ Sister Sadie Once Again Go “All In”

Last month, Sister Sadie took the stage at Nashville’s Station Inn to showcase and celebrate their latest album, No Fear. And although the title itself could be an ode to the group’s unrelenting urge to hop genre fences – from bluegrass to country to pop and back again – it’s also a nod to the resiliency of the band itself.

With No Fear, Sister Sadie showcase three-part, songbird harmonies backed by a keen musical aptitude that’s equally distributed throughout the quintet. The 13-song LP combines the “high, lonesome sound” of bluegrass with a blend of country and pop sensibilities a la The Chicks, Little Big Town, or Pistol Annies.

“There’s a space for bluegrass meets Americana meets country meets pop — that’s what I’m manifesting,” says fiddler and de facto band leader, Deanie Richardson.

To note, the Station Inn appearance was a full-circle sort of thing for the ensemble. First coming together at the storied venue by pure happenstance in December 2012, Richardson, banjoist Gena Britt, and former members guitarist Dale Ann Bradley, bassist Beth Lawrence, and mandolinist Tina Adair were simply a collection of pickers and singers from different circles in Music City.

That initial gig went extremely well, so much so that more shows were booked and things started to unfold into a full-fledged band – albeit one where the members still held day jobs and were raising families. But, the music felt right and so did the performances, so why not tempt fate and see where this ride may go?

Well, what a ride it has been thus far. Appearances on the Grand Ole Opry. Three IBMA awards for Vocal Group of the Year (2019, 2020, 2021) and one for Entertainer of the Year (2020), with Richardson taking home Fiddle Player of the Year in 2020. And a Grammy nomination for Best Bluegrass Album for the 2018 release, Sister Sadie II.

But, in recent years, three of those founding members — Bradley, Lawrence, and Adair — left to pursue other projects, which, in turn, posed one lingering question to Richardson and Britt — where to from here?

“When we started 12 years ago, when we hit that first note at the Station Inn, we felt this magical chemistry in the band,” Richardson says. “Somehow, every time we reinvent this [band], I still feel that magical chemistry when we play music.”

Instead of throwing in the towel and saying it was good while it lasted, Richardson and Britt forged ahead, come hell or high water. They regrouped and reemerged into this next, unknown chapter. Soon, Jaelee Roberts and Dani Flowers came into the fold, both bringing songwriting prowess as well as providing guitar and vocal harmonies to ideally complement Britt. Then, in 2023, bassist Maddie Dalton hopped onboard.

“It’s an eclectic group of ladies and of musical tastes,” Richardson says. “Our home, our hearts and our souls are in bluegrass music. That’s what we love, that’s our passion, but there’s a lot of room for growth there.”

The new album, it’s not bluegrass. It’s not country. It’s just good music. In my opinion, it would be a shame to pigeonhole your music.

Deanie Richardson: Well, that would be our dream, Garret, for someone to not try to put some sort of label or pigeonhole it into somewhere. But, unfortunately, it happens. We went in there with great tunes and just let them arrange themselves, let them work themselves out in the studio. And this is what we got. So, I didn’t go in with bluegrass in mind. I didn’t go in with country in mind. I just went in with all my pals, people I love — great players and great songs.

Is that more by design or just how things have evolved?

DR: I think that’s how it’s evolved. That was not the original [Sister] Sadie. That’s this combination of girls right here. When you have personnel changes like we’ve have along the way, the energy changes — everything shifts.

Gena Britt: You have to reinvent yourself.

DR: You’ve got to figure out where you land when Jaelee Roberts comes in and changes everything. And then you’ve got to figure out where you land when Dani Flowers comes in. And Maddie Dalton. We’ve had three new members. That changes the energy. It changes the vibe. It changes the feel. It changes the vocals. It changes everything. This whole band has grown organically over the last 12 years. This is just where it is right now. We’re about to go in and record a new one and, shoot, it may sound like ZZ Top. I don’t know — you never know.

And I have a lot of solidarity with that, the attitude of just go in and see what happens, see what sticks and see what works.

Dani Flowers: Every single person in this band is a big fan of good writing and good songs. Just trying to serve the song and make sure it had what it needed rather than trying to put any one certain song in a box that it might not fit in.

How does that play into personal goals with the band’s expectations? There’s a lot of a crossover factor in the music. I hear just as much country as I do bluegrass in there.

GB: We’re just going for what we feel. We want to be excited about the song as we want everybody that’s listening to be excited. When we’re in the studio, these songs were brought to life in such a great way.

With the new members, what was kind of the intent coming into the group?

Jaelee Roberts: When I was asked to audition, I was kind of flabbergasted, because I looked up to Sister Sadie. These are all my heroes playing together in a band. And I had grown up around them. It was such a surreal feeling to get to audition. I get to not only learn more from them than I was already learning from them, but I get to part of that and grow with them, bring my spin on stuff.

DF: It was definitely a no-brainer for me when it came to joining the band. I’ve known Deanie since I was 16 or 17, Gena since I was 19 or 20. I’ve always admired them both. They’re incredible at what they do. It was really great for me. I was in the music industry for a while. I had a record deal. I wrote for a publishing company. And then, I had a kid and kind of stopped doing it all for a while. So, to join a band full of women that I already love was a great way to get back into playing music.

And with founding members of a band leaving, there’s this creative vacuum that can occur, where maybe there are more opportunities for other people to step up.

DR: Oh, that’s so great, because it’s true. With the personnel changes we’ve had, there’s been more opportunities for different styles, different vocalists, different everything. It’s crazy how that energy shift just redirects everything. You find a new tunnel or rabbit hole to go down or a new vision. It’s super fun to hear those potential songs and figure out whose voice is going to work. If you listen to a song, it actually tells you where it wants to go.

GB: This band is kind of a melting pot. We all bring such different things to the band. And then, when you put it all together and mix it all together, it’s this great recipe for things that are magical. It’s just heartwarming, too. We actually hangout together when we’re not playing on the road — not a lot of bands do that.

With the band shakeup and everything that’s happened to Sister Sadie in recent years — winning the IBMA for Entertainer of the Year, switching record labels to Mountain Home — what made you decide to keep it going? Was there a moment of maybe shutting it down and doing something else?

DR: One hundred percent. You’re on it. With the last personnel change, Gena and I were on the phone like, “We’re 10 years into this thing. Is it time to call it? Maybe it’s just time.” This band happened by just a group of friends getting together and playing the Station Inn. Then, “Hey, that went really well. Let’s playing the Station Inn again.” Then, Gena starts getting calls from promoters. Do a few shows. Then, Pinecastle says, “Hey, let’s do a record.” We do a record. We do another record. We get nominated for a Grammy.

But, we’ve never really gone in 100 percent. It’s just been organic. I’ve got a ton of things going on. I’ve got a seven-year-old. Gena’s got a job and two kids. It’s never like, “Let’s form a band and let’s go do this.” It was always sort of The Seldom Scene thing — we’ll play when it makes sense. And then, I was like, “What if we give this thing everything we’ve got? What if we put in one 110 percent? What if we got a team? What if we got a manager? What if we got a new record label? What if we got a booking agent? Let’s devote one year to this 110 percent and see what happens” — that’s where we are.

I’m 52 years old. I’ve been doing this and on the road since I was 15. This is the best record we’ve ever done. Going all in was the best choice that we could’ve made.


Photo Credit: Eric Ahlgrim

Ed’s Picks: Country From All Corners

(Editor’s note: Each issue of Good Country, our co-founder Ed Helms will share a handful of good country artists, albums, and songs direct from his own earphones in Ed’s Picks. 

Sign up here to receive Good Country issues when they launch, direct to your email inbox via Substack.)






MIXTAPE: In the Same Room with Ethan Lipton & His Orchestra

Last year, my bandmates and I went into the woods to a studio that wasn’t a studio to record this collection of songs, Did You Do The Thing We Talked About? (Out February 16.) Some were songs from before the pandemic that meant a lot to us, and others were new songs I needed to write coming out of it.

Usually, when you go into the studio, you’re trying to maximize control, right? You put everyone in different rooms, isolate each sound, get a basic track, then have everyone redo their part until they’re happy with it. Then you add other instruments, effects, color.

We didn’t do that for this album. Coming out of the pandemic, we needed to share space again. We needed to be in the same room, to see each other’s fingers, to watch the crumbs clinging for dear life to each other’s shirts.

I wanted to make a record that sounded like the four of us communing.We all set up in one big room. Made baffles out of couches and blankets, like you do. We recorded in whole takes without overdubs or extra instruments. Our guitarist, Eben Levy, engineered the tracking. Our saxophonist, Vito Dieterle, and I did the cooking. Ian Riggs, our bass player, kept the tempos and the peace. The album sounds a lot like what our band sounds like on any given night after playing together for 20 years, and that’s just what we were after.

In creating this Mixtape of songs recorded “in the same room,” I was just trying to think of recordings by artists I revere that contain a sense of intimacy and life – I can’t say for sure how they were all recorded. More than anything, these songs make me feel like I’m listening to humans saying human things to other humans. That always makes me feel less alone in the world. – Ethan Lipton

“Walter Johnson” – Jonathan Richman

This is an a cappella recording, so how could it not be intimate? Still, I love this song about one of baseball’s all-time greats, and on this version, Richman sounds like he’s making it all up — lyrics, melody, tempo — as he goes. No one else could do a recording quite like this. Richman occupies a unique space in music, blending folk, garage rock, and proto-punk (?), but it’s his chops as goofball raconteur that I love most. This song also reminds me of my big brother, who introduced me to Richman and a lot of my favorite songwriters.

“Christmas Card from a Hooker in Minneapolis” – Tom Waits

Two pianos, Tom (acoustic) and George Duke (electric). And they create a whole universe together. To me it sounds like Tom is drunk and George is trying to hold him up. There’s so much air and grease and love in it. Blue Valentine isn’t my favorite Waits album — there are too many other exceptional ones — but I’m devoted to the epic narratives of this song and “Kentucky Avenue.” And “Christmas Card” has my favorite lyric ever: “I don’t have a husband / he don’t play the trombone.”

“I’ve Loved You All Over the World” – Willie Nelson

A nearly perfect album, and of course Daniel Lanois got Willie to record it in an old Mexican movie theater. It sounds like every musician on this track is dialed in to every other. I mean, if Bobbie Nelson’s clankity piano doesn’t break your heart, I don’t know what will. And Mickey Raphael’s harmonica is something I hear in my dreams. The drumming takes us into this whole other world. Lanois once said: “We had some nice risers set up for Willie and Emmylou [Harris] and the drummers. So we had a nice time setting it up like a club, and it sounds as though the fun that you’re hearing in the track was definitely in the building at the time.” Amen to that.

“Stardust” – Hoagy Carmichael

I don’t know how this recording was made, but the intimacy of it feels so honest and assured, you almost can’t believe there was a time when it didn’t exist. Nobody sings Carmichael’s songs like he does, and this version is full of his idiosyncratic phrasing. It’s hard not to see Hoagy sitting at the piano when you hear it. And the song itself, I mean ranking is ridiculous, but it has to be one of the best ever written.

Here are a couple of faves from our saxophonist, Vito Dieterle:

“Alone Together” – Lee Konitz, Brad Mehdlau, Charlie Haden

Lee Konitz was a huge inspiration to me. A true improviser. Brad Mehldau took the scene by storm with his virtuosity, but I always knew his roots were in the old masters, and this group showcases all facets of Brad’s talent in ways that few other albums do. And Charlie Haden brings everybody together in a grounding way like only he could.

This group was together only briefly but it captured the essence of playing jazz live and being in the moment with little ego, with true spontaneity and freedom within the confines of the traditional forms of the American songbook. These three were playing live all in the same room/club. The result was just magic. And pure sensitivity and support. I encourage everyone to explore the entire record.

“Fall” – Miles Davis Quintet

This composition by Wayne Shorter is a perfect example of what I consider a “musical trust fall.” A moment when you know everyone in that room has your back, so no matter what, you feel like you can’t fail. The tempo here is liquid, and the chances taken are mighty and bold. You can feel each musician digging into and supporting each other’s choices, and in some cases making those choices even more bold and beautiful in real time. This track changed my life. The first piece of music that truly made me aware of teamwork being the dream work, in a musical context.

Our bass player Ian Riggs wrote about two of his favorites, including another classic by Tom Waits: (The four of us come from different points of musically, but it’s rare for only one of us to like a particular song. In almost every case, one or more of the other three has big love for the same tune.)

“Semi Suite” – Tom Waits

From the quiet count-off to the rousing peak, this song is a wonderful instance of a group of people listening and breathing with each other in the same room. Bones Howe, the producer on this (The Heart of Saturday Night) and other early Waits albums, came from a jazz background and preferred to record musicians that way, without separation. I suppose a multi-tracked version of this song could have also been great, but I’m sure glad they gave this way a shot first.

“Switch Blade” – Duke Ellington, Charles Mingus, Max Roach

The stories about these “Money Jungle” sessions are legendary. They say it wasn’t the best day for Charles Mingus. Apparently he packed-up and stormed out more than once. Duke Ellington and Max Roach (an idol and longtime friend of his) talked him into staying each time. Mingus’ playing is wildly erratic but also beautiful and full of raw feeling. Thank goodness for wise friends who ask you to stay, especially on the bad days.

And here are a couple of picks from Eben Levy, our guitarist.

“Little Ditty” – Cyrus Chestnut

Pianist Cyrus Chestnut’s 1993 album Revelation, with Christopher J. Thomas on bass and Clarence Penn on drums, feels so alive because it’s so live. The liner notes state, “Recorded live to two-track analog at Clinton Studios, Studio B on June 7 & 8, 1993. Complete takes only, with no additional mixing or editing.” It’s all tightrope playing and tightrope engineering. Everyone involved nails the landing, like Kerri Strug. There’s zero filler on this album, but the track “Little Ditty” kills me every time. When Chesntut goes into the very highest keys after the break at about 1:40, the swing is so hard and so light at the same time. Philippe Petit!

“Tight Like That” – Asylum Street Spankers

The 2004 album Mercurial by the Asylum Street Spankers was recorded live in a 100-year-old church direct to a 2-track reel-to-reel tape deck. I love how much the room itself is a voice on the album. The drums are way in the back. The singer is right up front. Wait, holy shit! That harmonica is right in my face! And check out the old 20s barn burner “Tight Like That.” Great solos, and the Spankers mix in some of Jim Carroll Band’s “People Who Died” just to fuck with me.

Now that I see the tunes everyone picked, I can’t wait to listen to this mix-tape!!! There are pieces of all of us in each of these songs. – Ethan Lipton


Photo Credit: David Goddard